Driving Technique Discussion

Absolutely correct it isn’t as simple as I made out but this simplistic description gets the idea across so that you can then tune it to the car and the setup.

 

Nice explanation though i couldn't have said it better.

 

That's the best explanation I've seen, thanks!

 

Okay noted

 

Been trying to learn a bit from motec through some youtube videos and stuff; and from my limited understanding, the most amazing difference lies in how fast @n1lyn is able to go full throttle; everywhere i go gradually he seems to be able to always smash the throttle to the floor without any need go gradually like i do... And he gets zero wheelspin all the times!

I should maybe try to trust the car a bit more?

 

Wow, now that I'm CC 90 I was planning to try aggro setup, but gonna do that before

About the variance thingy is there any book or something that explains those kind of theory, I have no memory at all, can only memorize what I understand lol.

 

Likely yeah, but also looking at just the speed traces we can see that you are taking different (entry oriented) line so even if you'd utilize the car to the fullest potential you still likely loose on those exits.
There does not seem to be a GPS track for ACC workspace to compare lines more easily like in AC. I wonder if somebody already made one, as it should be possible to do it from LAT/LON acceleration.

@Jetsun There are some guidebooks and also Motec has proper manual built in, but without actually diving in and using it to calculate stuff the knowledge will evaporate fast anyways

 

I think if you take a look at steering angle when I go full throttle, you'll likely see that I'm already turning a lot less at that point when you do, indicating that I have a lot more rotation done and the car is pointing to the straight

 

Yes as mentioned this corner doesn't really lend itself to trail braking. A quick dab before turn in and then a small amount of throttle during turn in works in the case.

 

You braked too late for that corner and you want to turn in with too much speed. You are also release the brake pedal a bit too fast. Trailbraking should be kept at a minimum.

 

That was really a golden advice to me, I'm very surprised on how you easily feel the lock up in ACC, and how it is helpful as a learning process, I feel like I was 0-1 breaking before that, I keep the car far more balanced.

when I increase back the bias, I do so up to the point I have no more snap oversteer in turn in braking, is that correct?

I now am at 0.5 of my previous best with still some flatspoting here and there, (first time I thought my ffb was broken, then wonder if that was a puncture ) I so love this new way of driving that I'll try to stick with it to practice trail braking before going back to ABS 1

I'm now trying n1lyn setup (ABS 0, TC 1) and I handle it far more better than my first try, great! Even if putting ABS off feels really dangerous and weird at first, sounds like it really cuts down the learning process

 

You might enjoy this advice as much as I did, good to improve all kind of breaking:
here it is

 

Nice! Glad it worked for you. From personal experience 0.5s is around the time lost by running without electronics. Congrats

The question of brake bias can be tricky as it depends on a lot of things, but yeah, as you gain pace and confidence, the car should get more and more oversteery on entry which you then fix with more forward brake balance. If it doesn't do that, or it both oversteers and locks up the front at the same time, try different lines instead of fighting the brakes.

Also, just for this challenge try TC at 0. There are a few interesting discoveries to be made on this combo. (if makes the car too oversteery to drive, give a front ride height a click or two up)

 

Braking with ABS on and off is quite different.
Not using ABS on GT3 doesn't make much sense and you don't improve much on your driving with it off once you turn ABS on, although having it off can be fun and rewarding, but just for the kick of it.

Using TC off, now that is another thing altogether and everything you improve in your driving method by having it off will be put to good use even with TC on.

 

You might wanna change your mind about that, it does help me a lot, mainly because of my heavy left foot:

At the same time it prepares me for some openwheel, DTM and other fun
As both of you are pointing out this TC Off stuff I'll go wild very soon

 

My point is simple: once you have ABS on, the modulation required when ABS is off, precisely to prevent wheel locking, is not required any more, thus why the method for braking with ABS off is different than when ABS is on, and that method doesn't improve much your braking, if anything at all, the moment you start using ABS.
The brake use, namely bleed the brake pedal pressure on turn in (trail braking), is related to the car balance rather than with wheel lock, and is a method used with either ABS on or off.
If anything, the method to brake without ABS is contra productive when ABS is used, simply because it's much more difficult to continuously be more efficient modulating the brakes with the foot than with use of electronics, ending up by not applying the full braking force when trying manually to avoid wheel locking with ABS engaged.

 

I'm no specialist at all, but here is how I imagine it works: if you press too hard, the abs will adjust the breaking force so that it is at the level just before wheel locking, whatever your foot position behind this limit will always produce the same braking force then.
When you tail break you want to lower the breaking force as soon as you start releasing your foot because some of the grip is necessary to turn in. If your foot is too far beyond the locking limit, when you release brake the abs will keep the braking force constant, so as you are already steering and expecting to have lowered your braking, you'll lose grip... That's why I feel important that my left foot have memory of locking point. If that makes sense.

 

I don't know how you brake without ABS, but with me it's not just a question of how deep the brake pedal goes but, braking until it starts to lock and then modulate the pedal, releasing a tiny bit to unlock, pressing again a tiny bit more until it locks and so forward.
I find this modulation harder to do the closer the car is from the turn in, because the tendency to locking is higher as the speed decreases and, simultaneously, each time the brake pedal is pressed must be less than the previous one, as the speed is reducing.

With ABS is just a matter of pressing the pedal, followed by a continuous release as the car is approaching the turn in.

ABS On


ABS OFF

 

ok, let's say that as I'm lazy I prefer the hard way

oh and may I ask what is TC2 in the setup?