Driving Technique Discussion

Hello! I am pretty comfortable with front engine cars, but I can't find the consistency with mid engine cars. Mid corner the car either understeers or the rear just floats away with little control causing me to lose a lot of laptime. Can you give me some setup or driving technique tips? I've been trying adjusting anti-roll and suspension which is great, but as the car's balance changes with different fuel loads I feel it isn't the way.

 

Search "flat car theory" and read some articles on Rob Wilson.
Weight transfer is what you are focusing on under breaking and is the key factor in racing. It's good to introduce a little weight transfer early and let the car settle forward before full braking and downshifting, but you can use that transfer of weight in conjunction with light steering inputs to add rotation in some situations. Three things will move the weight of the car forward. Engine braking when you come off the gas, downshifting to a lower gear, and of course, applying brakes. The art is in how you blend the three. If you are in fifth gear at redline and let off the gas you are getting two of the weight transfer mechanisms automatically- engine compression and gear ratio, and that alone will affect handling in a profound way before you even touch the brakes.

There are a number of factors to take into account for various types of turns and speeds that will help you manage weight transfer.
RPM when you get to the marker is the first factor that dictates how to approach braking and downshifting- Are you at high rpm, or lower rpm? At high rpm you generally should brake and then pause before downshifting in order to let the weight move forward. At lower rpm, you can put the downshift closer to the braking or even simultaneous. At the end of a high speed strait- when you hit your mark and brake, you should instantly grade your position and speed and grip, (am I long, short, or on the mark?) and the rest of the braking can be adjusted as needed. If you are short- hold off on the downshifting and grab lower gears late and quick. This will get back some of the time you lost from braking too early. If you feel you are long- grab the second downshift quickly and re evaluate. If you are in a comfortable and well timed braking mode, (not too fast or slow) you can do smooth and even downshifting. It's important to know how to successfully and consistently complete a braking sequence under all three scenarios, (long, short, or on the mark) because you need to deploy each of these scenarios on demand in order to actually race. For instance- To pull off an out-braking maneuver, or a defensive move, you will most likely need to be a little long of your base brake mark and therefore you need to learn how to pull aggressive downshifting and braking on the ragged edge and maintain control over a shorter distance. If you are conserving fuel or managing tires you will brake short and ease it in, or to save time, brake short and light and then go hard on the brakes later . Your base brake mark is what you should use for fast cruising or running consistent laps, and being able to hit that mark consistently is everything.

Learn when to deploy a late upshift, and when to hit the redline. A late upshift is a common technique used to settle the car going into turns with a sweeping entrance. You upshift just before braking in order to get the rpm's down, and then downshift right with the brakes. This will induce a more controllable rotation than you have coming from higher rpm's and a lower gear. But if it's a turn you want to flick it in to you might enter with higher rpm and the car will rotate more easily under braking and you can coast and scrub brake to the apex.

For the past couple years I've been soaking up everything I can get from the web of Rob Wilson and his theories, and it really boils down to two things- Maintain a "flat car", and shorten the time spent under turning and braking. He has a brilliant analogy for managing tire temps and ware; "Hold your hand over a large flame for an instant and nothing happens, but hold your hand over a low flame for a long time and you will get burned badly". In practice on the track this means braking hard and late but with pre-load, and converting wide arcing turns into triangles and going diagonally in and out.

 

This whole thread is amazing. I'll asked questions a couple times, and mega answers.
I didn't know where to put this, or should have started a new thread, but here goes.
I love the feel of Silverstone and been driving it with the Aston. Best laps are low 2:01's with a very occasional drop to 2:00.8.
Used data to see my driving line and such for improvements.
When offline, I normally race 20 AI cars with 95% skill and can get up to around 10th then playing catch up for the guys ahead.
I changed today to set to 10 cars with 97% AI so I could play more like online mode where consistency is the best.
Here is my laptimes (track optimum)

4 laps under 2:01, with 8 laps under 2:01.4
By lap 10 I right behind the first 3 (who were huddled together) and then I outbraked myself. I did the same on lap 15.


I'm stoked with this and amazed that I was able to do the above. I'm also happy about my consistency between lap 2-8 as I'm within 1 sec of my best lap.
Its really annoying that I couldn't break the 2 min barrier... so many times, I was 0.2 up on best lap then lost time at hairpin or final corner.. mega annoying.

I kept the replays so I can analyse the lines that I took, but bummed that I didn't have Motec or Z1 running. BUUUUUT if I did it once, I can do it again.

 

Post a video of one of your better laps (onboard). Only then we can look at the driving and see the issues.

 

I did a race and got my best times around 2:01's, which I wondered why. My 2:00's are for 2018 Silvestone and most people race on 2019.
Is this due to changes in BoP for the Aston?
Lines, etc should be the same, just nice for me to realize this so when qualifying, I'm not wondering how I lost over 1 second.

Here laps 2 and 3
Lap 2 - I overtake, which was nice for me, 3 I make at least 1 mistake.
With both of them, I'm sure I'm drafting, so higher top speed than normal.

 

nice video. seems that we are at a similar "stage" in our racing career.
my times are nearly the same, little slower, but different car. some corners you are better, more agressive, later breaking than me.
dont know if the aston can do it, but yesterday i drove the amg and into maggotts i found a lot of time with breaking later, think you can try it. becketts is faster when you are more on the inside, earlier on the pedal.

 

Try and trail the brake a little better, you are used to cars that have more inertia but more weight on the front. If you trail the brake more at turn in and turn a little harder mid corner you can find more speed in these cars.
Wrt antiroll bars, it's pretty much the same. A stiff front ARB gives good turn in, but makes the front wash wide mid corner. A stiffer rear ARB gives stability at turn in but might hop mid corner and spin the inside wheel on exit.

2:03 to 2:25 is a good bad example.
In Luffield you're pulsating the throttle, this just loses you grip through all of the corner. You might also want to review your line there.
Copse is simple, you turn in a bit early, so you mash the throttle before the apex, which loses you a ton of grip. Then you go out wide so you have to wait longer before getting on the gas again.
Braking later is a very dumb way to gain speed, a mate of me used to be seconds faster per lap, but somehow he was always braking sooner. Be critical of your ideal line and see if you can release the brake a bit earlier to maintain momentum.

 

What is the difference between Silverstone 2018 vs Silverstone 2019? On 2018 I have 1:58 and 2019 2:01 I think or maybe 2:00, not sure, can't check it now.

 

Before the Silverstone 2018 race the track had been freshly resurfaced, so it provided lots of grip. 2019 it isn't so fresh anymore, so laptimes are a few seconds slower.

 

@sissydriver I tried to use the late apex line with Beckets so I could get on the throttle earlier. AI use a tighter line as you mentioned. I'll try the different lines and see what I can change.
@rdmracer I used to brake into Copse at the 50m mark, but I've started to break about 5-10 before. This enables me to get the apex and on the throttle earlier to gain 0.2.
I'll try to turn in later. I know I do this sometimes as I don't go wide on the exit, so I need more consistency.
Luffield is always a nightmare for me. I just have a hard time with that corner (and other slow corners). I need to be more patient and let the car coast, then I can start to be more aggressive.
Village and the Loop are pain points for me with inconsistency as well. In mp races, it always seems that people take Village SOOO much faster.
For Loop, I use timing and the force for my braking point as I don't have time to see one. This means that depending up on my line and speed through Village, I'm inconsistent with Loop. I know when I get it right as its a late apex with no wheel spin or sliding on the exit.

Love all the advice.
I nearly got a mp win on Silverstone yesterday, but binned it getting past a back-marker (had a 3sec lead). I can go past slower vehicles, but too much pressure as I was leading the race. Stupid me tried to save it and span instead of taking the hit and going slow.

My laptimes and vid is from stock aggressive setup with changed tires pressures to get them to around 28 during a lap

 

I’ve been sim racing for years, since GTR2. I dipped in and out, not really learning anything, just having fun. As a result, I was dog slow and only ever raced against the AI.

Things changed for me recently. I moved to Texas and got a bigger house so that I finally had room for a proper racing rig, so I invested in a decent setup. When ACC was released, I jumped on early access and was instantly smitten. Things started to click with me. I started using the CC rating to take a closer look at how I was driving. I began to feel more confident.

Then I took the plunge and joined a league. I decided to focus. In the first season, I picked the Ferrari and stuck with it (as league rules mandated). ACC was now all I raced in and my focus was entirely on getting to know how the Ferrari behaved on whatever track we were racing on that weekend. At the end of the season I had improved and was solidly mid-pack.

Now we’re nearing the end of season two, and I’m in the Aston, a fantastic car. I know it inside and out. But because of the level of focus I’ve given to really understanding a single car at a time in only one sim, I’ve really improved. I’m no alien, probably a couple of seconds shy of that, but now I’m often the mid field leader and can fight for podiums too.

All this is to say that I raced for years and years with zero progress. But one year with ACC, with a decent rig and by joining a league, I’m suddenly a decent racer. Couldn’t be happier about it, thanks Kunos for giving me exactly the sim I always wanted. And thanks to my friends at ESR for letting me race with them

 

I am very similar, what I've done for years is just throwing cars around in the early access of pCARS and running standard setup racing.
Started taking iRacing seriously a year and a half ago and moved on to ACC one this sim was ready.
There's one downside to only ever racing F2000 Skippies and Porsches. And that is that cars with heavier noses become much more difficult in comparison.

 

Thanks buddy, i spend some time checking CC and now my Rating is:



Keep pushing!!


Bye the way i´m Bronze, what categories are and what you need to upgrade!

 

Hello!
I am new to this game, and have been in this game for 100 hours now.
I am learning car, tracks, and most of the times I run with default aggressive setups.
Most of the time I am in practice session, and practice, test, and learn to drive.
And soon I will start to learning to do some setups to the car by watch videos, and just by trying out settings on track.

My current setup for the game is Trustmaster TX wheelbase with Formula one wheel for this game with
T3PA Pro pedals. Now when learning the game and practice I use my monitor to play on. But later when game is more balanced and stable I will play it with my HP Reverb VR headset.
My current ratings are: TR: 99 - CN: 80 - CC: 82 - PC: 0 - SA: 71 - RC: 99 - CP: 0

Now, is there anyone out here that is in current situation like me, new to the game and want to learn track, cars, setups and do practice and learning together? ( If you are a pro and want to share your skills you are welcome to )

 

Guys, explain me, how can I improve my Car Control points? I know basic informations from game, but what am I doing wrong?

TC points - I have 92, but I know how to easily improve it - I still didn't play every track in game,
CN points - 84 is not much, but not bad as well, I think this is connected with SA points,
CC points - 72, do I have to play more cars? (I play ONLY Lexus RCF), I don't know how can I turn on this table shows how good you are in different sectors in Hot Lap mode,
SA points - still growing up, slowly, but raising,
RC points - growing up, my favorites points, I like racing, not hot lapping, love to have cool head

Those my profil stats (I play only MP, just played 31% of Career, sometimes play Training to improve car setup):



Race stats (multiplayer only):



Car Control points from last races:


Replays from driving technique:

 

You can enable the stats screen for CC Rating. Should be under options and than HUD i think, change it from "Auto" to "Car Control". Than you widget which will show you if you using your car to the limit. Blue means youre too slow in the sector and yellow and red means youre overdriving. Looking at the picture it looks like youre overdriving a lot on the car. Just watched the first video a little bit, your pace isnt too bad but your overturn your wheel all the time, CC probably will tell you too much steering on nearly all corners.
It also has nothing to do with different cars. I only drive the Ferrari and fluctate between 80-95cc depending on the track and my performance.
CN also has nothing to do with SA rating it just shows your probaly driving inconstistent.
If you want to rise your overall rating you have to start doing Compraces and the special events.

 

#Rabbit - I'll try to find it and training under this in Hot Lap mode. Hmm, maybe I'm overdriving because of understeery Lexus? I compare my movie to hot lap found on YT and yes, this guy turning steering wheel about 20% less than me:

pause at 0:50
pause at 1:01

 

I would suggest that you use normal practice mode for training, since you dont have tire wear in hotlap mode and the grip level also differs from normal.
The understeer issue could be because you might brake too late and have too much speed in the corners. But im no expert on Spa, so have a look at your own replay and see where youre not using the whole track and where youre turning the wheel too much.

 

Could always be different steering ratio
But in general whether through setup or driving style, he uses less steering because his car is turned more. That is, you both have the same slip angle of the front tyres, but you have to turn steering more since the whole car is turned less.

Now while it does seem like he has more aggressive setup, you could do the same line with yours too. You'd have to enter the corner with more speed (at the point of brake lift he is 10km/h faster) or later so you have speed or space to lean on the rear tyres properly and rotate the car.
Also entering the corner faster allows for keeping the car longer on the brakes which allows you to "bank" some oversteer in the rear tyres (he lifts the brakes slower, gaining more yaw momentum from it than you). This bank reduces the effort needed for front tyres to rotate the car, leaving more grip for cornering.
So while normally understeer is attributed to overspeed, in this case it's the lack of speed that is causing it.

Also, you are not using full potential of the brakes. It's not a big deal, but getting that red brake bar reach max travel could net you 0.05-0.1 over the course of the lap.


As for CC it does feel a bit strange to be in low 70's with that kind of driving, but i haven't driven Lexus in ages. It does seem that you are not pushing rear tyres enough. Or at least do not control their slip well, keeping them near the limit only for short periods of time, and sometimes going over the limit for a moment. This would reduce the CC, but idk by how much.
My advice for practice would be to get the car more oversteery (to a point where it feels slow), by softening front roll bar and/or reducing rear wing. And then take it easy on slow corner exits and focus the practice on being smooth and consistent on entries/mid corner. After you get comfortable go back to old setup and drive it harder than normal (but keep taking it easy on exits). Likely both CC and laptimes will see improvements.