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2019 Cars and Tracks BOP Discussion

Discussion in 'ACC General Discussions' started by redlinemotorsport.co.uk, Oct 26, 2019.

  1. Honestly it's 95% driving style. post the screenshot of your bestlaps and I can prove it.
    Bop is intended to match the cars performance. The car performance at a good level. If the driver cannot extract the pace from it, he cannot complain about the BOP.

    I mean, you do 2.20 at spa with Ferrari complaining it's slow, then another Ferrari does 2.16...no the problem is you. The point is that no one can make a 2.15 with ferrari, to see a 2.14 on a amg would be really weird. Then we can discuss about bop.
     
    lero and SellerieMitDip like this.
  2. My last post, not because this conversation isn't valid but it just isn't valid for me.

    You went a bit off piste with the last post, as did I when ranting about CP races and the US audience so far. Suffice to say ACC is a real life simulator of the Blancpain GT Sprint and Endurance series and by all intents an purposes is classified as a game as well, and that's ok.

    I'll try to illustrate more the reason why I mentioned you being so off pace but then talking about BOP. I know you joked about making tomato sauce and turning in lap times, well, I'll wager as well that if you wake me up out of a drunken stupor with the flu on Spa with the Huracan I can turn a 2.17 without missing a beat. So what, well turns out being at the fore front of pace you're able to notice certain things. If you do the same, on a cold track with green track status, I'll burn and crash 8 out of ten times at Eau Rouge if going full throttle. Car simply will not grip unless I'm millimeter perfect. The other 2/10 times I get a cut warning because I have to straight shot the corner to not crash at 250kph. Fast track it's almost on rails, and then there's still the Lamborghini syndrome to watch out for. BOP, restricts certain car chassis tire sizes and that has an effect on performance. In that scenario, a skilled driver in an AMG that loves colder weather will walk away from me driving at 9/10ths.

    7 seconds off pace, is probably be taking Eau Rouge at 210 kph max instead of full throttle exiting at 243kph. At the end of the straight I'd be down about 15 kph on top speed. That loss then carries through out the lap, which again wouldn't matter because 7 seconds off pace.

    There's so much that goes into BOP other than just engine restrictions, on power and torque (individually). When you're into the last few tenths you tend to notice the nuances in car behavior at the limit, thats why being off pace by light years is so important. You mentioned top speed of the Audi is way better than the Jaguar. It is, you raced a 2019 spec car, with vastly superior aero platform and most likely an engine that had different BOP parameters than the Jaguar did (which is a 2014 car?). You simply just said how much faster the Audi was.... BUT OF COURSE it's faster, it fuking should be man. That's not to say that what you're saying has no value, it does but maybe not in the way that you think.

    Real life BOP, in a simulation of a real life championship.

    Your GT Sport analogy... has no place other than to say that you prefer it, its for all intents and purposes fake (ie. made up) BOP to satisfy the colossal player base that GT has. And... that's ok. No hate, just preference and opinion.

    Kunos' implementation of BOP in this sim IMO is spot on, the remaining problems are not in BOP.

    PS. not trying to be an *****le, just try see my point of view here.
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2020
  3. CheatingTJ

    CheatingTJ Gamer


    Maybe you're generalizing a few things and miss interpreting others (no offense). That's why you're not getting what ACC is all about, I think.
    You can treat a video game as a simulator... a simulator is a video game. You're confusing casual games with simulator games.. the first being NFS and the second being ACC (midle term would be GTSport and maybe... maybe... Forza).

    Kunos is still adding things to the game to make it closer to IRL. Just because it doesn't have a feature now, doesn't mean they're not working to implement it later (like chassi flex). About the pace car... it's a feature that I would like to see and I think it's necessary, but @Aristotelis said in one of his streams that it would be necessary to acquire a license to put it in the game... so they prefered to focus (a.k.a. spend monon other priorities). Also... not everything that happens IRL works when you're playing a game. I don't think anybody would want to spend 90 minutes in each Free Practice session and 60 minutes on each Qualifying session to start every single race. So there's a compromise made here to make the game more enjoyable. This doesn't mean it stopped being a simulator.

    About the Career, the game does have it... but you can't expect it to be like NFS with a storyline.

    It's just my opinion... but I don't think the community has this bipolar disorder that you're talking about. Forza community has this. Before playing simulators I used to play Forza on my xbox one... and a lot of the players think it's a simulator... others think it isn't... and there's no general agreement by the community. I don't think it's a simulator... but I think it does it's job of entertaining very well. In here I don't think I've ever heard anybody else saying that ACC is a casual game. If anything I've heard comparisons about it's physics being more realistic or not than other games like iracing or RF2 with the general consensus being that ACC and RF2 are the closest to the real life car physics.
     
    SellerieMitDip and eRacer212 like this.
  4. eRacer212

    eRacer212 Racer

    Yes, you are right, Eu Rouge I want to take full throttle but I can't. I could if I went a gear up to keep traction and perhaps that way I'd lose less time.
    Would be very nice if someone posted a video of those 1:19 laps. At the end of the day, learning is much of repeating what others do.
    Still, that doesn't explain 2 seconds difference per lap between the Aston, which I'm comfortable with, and the Audi which I'm not comfortable at all, but is simply faster.
    Anyways, I will record it, and you will see my inputs. It is so evident. I will record that asap and then I will post it here.

    ps: I will also try to make a 1:19 so @TRIAS can then respect my opinion lol
     
  5. I mean, we literally just talked about that. But yes ok, post those videos just not here to not hijack the thread as it's already been hijacked. Cool that you're trying to learn, there's tons of videos of hotlaps on the youtubes, check them out.

    Gl sir, I'm out.
     
  6. azzah

    azzah Racer

    It's really baffling to see you reading a bunch of people saying "it partly comes down to driving style" but you keep ignoring - even outright rejecting it.

    Let me have a try:
    So you're saying that you are 2s slower in the Aston than in the Audi. And you're saying that you're "comfortable" with the Aston, but not with the Audi.
    Maybe try driving the Aston in a way that is uncomfortable to you?

    The cars have wildly different characteristics. If you are way slower with one car than with another that means most of the time that you will have to drive the car differently to cope with it.

    Sometimes you might struggle with a certain (type of) car, or a certain track/car combination and you just can't figure out how to reach a similar pace than you have with others. There's no fault in that, it is completely normal.

    Trying to blame BOP for these deficiencies might also be normal, but you're lying to yourself if you do so, esp. with the laptimes others are able to achieve with the cars.
     
    Vunnible, lero, trasgu and 1 other person like this.
  7. SimGuy_1

    SimGuy_1 Alien

    I like this, i share the same opinion.
    buffing weak instead of nerfing faster one should be the way.
     
    Cristian Haba likes this.
  8. Yah I'm down with this as well, yo Kunos, can we get +50 bhp for the 2014 Bentley and Jaguar on all tracks, except Spa, +75bhp there. We test for you, it will be good I swear.

    lol, also make the Honda faster, I suggest you guys look into V-Tech and when it should properly kick in.
     
  9. Mach77

    Mach77 Racer

    you forgot to add more downforce to the Reiter Engineering Gallardo R-EX. it's so bad that this car is almost forgotten. kinda like the 2015 GT-R :D
     
  10. eRacer212

    eRacer212 Racer

    Why does it surprise you? These are just opinions, doesn't mean I have to accept them as truth.
    Also, you should find a common ground, some of you say is 95% driving style, now you say is 'partially' the driving style. There is a long way between 95 and 'partially'. But that's my point, these are just opinions.
    If you can lap Spa in 2:16 that doesn't make you right, it makes you bloody quick.
     
  11. Mach77

    Mach77 Racer

    well, with 95% driving style, there's still 5% that's remaining. so, yeah. it's still partially. and in the 5% you have half of it which is the car's performance itself and the other half which is the comfort between the driver and the car. a driver that is comfortable in a certain car will surely be quicker in it than a car that doesn't suits him. even in engine displacement, there's some variations. an AMG will definately not drive the same as a BMW for example. and someone quick as hell in the BMW will maybe not always be fast in the AMG or in the Aston V12 or V8(in terms of FR cars)
     
  12. Cravenor

    Cravenor Gamer

    Aristotelis from Kunos recently stated that the difference that a Good Setup can bring is about 0.5 to 1 Second per lap. 80% is driving technique, Practice and reference points. If you are 5 seconds off the pace, It's the Problem between seat and wheel... You. Thats Not BoP or Setup. It's your car handling.
     
    eRacer212 likes this.
  13. Mach77

    Mach77 Racer

    about 0.5 to 1 second? well, I gained way more in the NSX Evo :D I'm about 2 seconds off pace from the insanely quick guys and I think that it's the maximum that I can do with it. but I'm loving it :p
     
    Tim Meuris likes this.
  14. Cravenor

    Cravenor Gamer

    The Time you gained will be most Related to practicing with the NSX and get used to it. Btw. I also like the NSX alot. :D
     
    Tim Meuris likes this.
  15. eRacer212

    eRacer212 Racer

    And if both cars have the aggressive preset out of the box? Would be nice if someone tested the Audi and the Aston and record it and posted it.
    I'll do that but on Saturday.
     
  16. Cravenor

    Cravenor Gamer

    I've Seen Alien times with almost every Car in ACC, it just depends which car suits your driving style best. Maybe you are quickest in aston or Porsche, but you struggle in the AMG or Bentley. But thats Not by BoP, thats by the General characteristics of the Car itself. Or you are a Alien and General quick, even in a tincan on wheels. :D

    BoP doesn't mean each Car is the same in It's behavior, it means each Car is capable of the almost same Laptime in general. But how the Car produces this Time is different.
     
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2020
  17. azzah

    azzah Racer

    Then your opinion is that you should be equally quick in any car? Or that you don't have to learn the intricacies of the different cars to drive them quickly?
    Sure, go ahead and be of the opinion that it's the car's fault and not the driver's. But don't be surprised when others voice their opinion and call you out on that fallacy.
    I used that term specifically so I don't put words into the mouths of the people I indirectly quoted. Also, about 78% of the time, I'm very reluctant of pulling numbers out of my posterior.
    I'm happy if I can pull off a 2:19, but thank you.

    The thing is though: when I see other people driving 2-3s (or even more) quicker than me, often in the same cars I might add, I know that generally it is me who is slower, not the car or the setup.
     
    eRacer212 likes this.
  18. Pump the brakes on the common sense sir, it's alarming.
     
    Cravenor likes this.
  19. eRacer212

    eRacer212 Racer

    Absolutely agree with this opinion, that is exactly what I'm saying all day. The difference should be the driver and not the machine. That is the spirit of the BoP.
     
    Titi Colectinha likes this.
  20. Cravenor

    Cravenor Gamer

    That you are 2 seconds faster in the Audi over the Aston is no BoP problem, i've Seen Audi, mercedes, lambo, aston and ferrari in Spa, all within 0.3 Seconds on the first 8 Qualifying Times... You just don't Drive the Aston quick enough. That you Feel comfortable, doesn't mean you are quick...
     
    lero likes this.
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