1. Do you need support for Assetto Corsa Competizione? Please use the proper forum below and ALWAYS zip and attach the WHOLE "Logs" folder in your c:\users\*youruser*\AppData\Local\AC2\Saved. The "AppData" folder is hidden by default, check "Hidden items" in your Windows view properties. If you report a crash, ALWAYS zip and attach the WHOLE "Crashes" folder in the same directory.
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  3. If your game executable is missing, please add your entire Steam directory to the exceptions in your antivirus software, then run a Steam integrity check or reinstall the game altogether.

ACC - Sound Design

Discussion in 'ACC General Discussions' started by Ozelot S, Mar 23, 2018.

  1. tow

    tow Racer

    ACC braking sounds like whistle, AC1 sound mod much better, the braking sound got "metal grinding" feel.

     
  2. Epistolarius

    Epistolarius Alien

    Maybe it's just me (and with the praise all these sound mods always get it seems to be just me) but this still sounds very digital to me at places.
     
    Raklödder and After_Midnight like this.
  3. Mr Latte

    Mr Latte Racer

    To DEVS

    More volume control of individual sound elements/effects would be greatly appreciated. AC was good but please bring more for ACC
    This has not only an aspect of a user being able to adjust to a personal preference mix for the heard audio but also benefits with "Tactile Immersion"

    I generally can monitor game audio output and see the frequencies for certain effects in real-time. If we take the example of some kerbs = brrrrrrrrrrr . and use specific EQ to highlight this effects the main frequencies used.
    We can boost the audio of this effect or its feel in tactile. Of course, altering this then boosts other effects utilising the same frequencies.

    So what we need within the game is the ability to have specific volume control for more effects and an important one is curbs as these can enhance the immersion but also increase the stereo representation.
     
    tow and MjNoisen like this.
  4. ShredatorFIN

    ShredatorFIN Alien

    nvm
     
    MjNoisen likes this.
  5. Andrew_WOT

    Andrew_WOT Alien

    Why not drive transducers off telemetry like everyone else?

    Actually, never mind. Don"t bother to reply.
     
  6. Raklödder

    Raklödder Simracer

    As mentioned already, more control over your audio (engine, effects, track, tires, etc.) will go a long way and allow us to improve the audio levels to our own taste.

    Also good high quality recordings in general is a must have for a modern 2018 racing game and I know that you can deliver AC levels of quality and beyond.
     
    tow likes this.
  7. ShredatorFIN

    ShredatorFIN Alien

    Well that what I was about to comment, shouldn't the default audio levels do, if sim has a good realistic audio mix? Not like what you hear in a car is subjective, any more than realistic physics are

    But of course there is people with impaired hearing (I'm actually myself, few freqs slightly down) and different sound systems. But realistic audio isn't really matter of taste. Sim racers tend to turn tyre vol up to ridiculous level, to hear grip and gain competitive edge. Which is fine I guess, but somehow it's imo a bit retarded.. I wouldn't mind if there isn't many (or any) sliders, if the base mix is good

    But yeah telemetry is the way to drive your transducers, audio is really bad way to do it anyway
     
    Last edited: Sep 2, 2018
  8. Epistolarius

    Epistolarius Alien

    Well, the audio mix in AC wasn't exactly perfect though (kerbs generally too quiet, tyres really loud regardless of compound, wind equally loud across all cars, engines too loud in some street cars, etc.), so having some more settings for individual things might be a good idea unless Kunos do the mix in ACC really well (they have to deal with fewer cars after all).
     
    mESCx and ShredatorFIN like this.
  9. ShredatorFIN

    ShredatorFIN Alien

    Yeah emphasis on if the base mix is good. But it probably will be better indeed (there can be tweaks during EA too, based on for example pro's feedback) since there's far less cars now (all similar style)
     
  10. Andrew_WOT

    Andrew_WOT Alien

    Audio, graphics, and ffb settings should be straightforward and accessible for a regular user.
    There is no reason for adding one hundred options for either just to hide the deficiencies of original implementation. Kunos have been good with that so far, hopefully the trend stays.
     
    ShredatorFIN likes this.
  11. Mr Latte

    Mr Latte Racer


    Let me add some insight.....

    By having more individual effects control then we bring more potential to controlling the audio output for tactile purposes. You are aware as others are that with telemetry based tactile we have individual control for specific effects. This is one of its main benefits. If a game enables me to increase the engine, output but also the curb noise with individual volume control then we can bring more sensation to the felt tactile these generate. We can monitor what Hz specific effects in the audio use and boost these frequencies to how we desire to help enhance them. Another effect may use the same frequencies but if we have for instance curb noise at a higher output level via the games output mix, then this effect is bringing more tactile sensation above others as we boost the frequencies.

    Few will have gone to the lengths I have in testing or research, however it is also possible with the game audio to use specialist hardware. One such example is a "Subharmonic Bass Processor". What these do is generate LOWER harmonics of sounds below the original Hz the effects use. Basically, giving you ultralow bass harmonics from sounds that are only low- midbass by themselves.

    I have already tested ACC audio-tactile based on the videos released and it has some excellent tactile response, even from the videos and unknown settings. If you want try some and boost the 20Hz by 15dB or more and 60Hz range by 5 or so to feel the difference these make even with simple software EQ on a soundcard.


    Over the last 24 months or so I have spent quite some time evaluating all the main telemetry software options. I have also learned that in many titles there is hidden bass below 20Hz within some games audio output that can be boosted by EQ hardware/software to bring more sensation to tactile felt from a games audio. Of course, we may not want to do this for headphones or speakers but only for the tactile and yes this is possible by duplicating the audio output. Having audio for headphones for example, untouched but audio, for tactile output being controlled for improved sensations.

    My own reasons and desire to combine "Audio Tactile" and NOT leave it out, is that it brings specific detailing and also output for various elements that do nothing in Simvibe etc for the simple reason they have no telemetry output for such but they do have an audio response within the games actual sound effects. Additionally, many cars can bring much more of the true engine/transmission character that is not possible in telemetry tactile and audio can also bring heightened curb detail and improved stereo tactile immersion.

    With the test rig I am working on, if I want to mix the output of effects from telemetry based software options like Simvibe, SSW or Shakeit I can mix their effects and control specific channels. Determining how strong any effect or source is, or entirely muting it via 1 or all channels it is outputting. I have even played about with using advanced custom created .wav effects for SSW mixed with rather nice engine effects from Shakeit and both of these running but also combined with EQ boosted Audio Tactile.

    This allows me to understand and feel what each brings or how when combined we can take things even further regards immersion.

    BTW, tyre squeal noise is not something we need to boost or rely on so much.
    I have an excellent custom effect created via a .wav for SSW and I can set its operation/threshold to activate in conjunction with the wheelslip lights found on cars like the C7R or Porsche GT3 RSR. So I can feel the wheelslip via the tactile based on a feeling/sensation I determined and created. This then operates the tactile as the telemetry values are in balance with the cars dash display. Its basically having good operating traction loss in tactile.

    Simvibes "Oversteer" effect very much sucks in comparison. Shakeit has a similar feature too but for certain effects, I find more control/performance is possible in building an actual waveform (often from multilayers) for SSW. To then use this sound effect response to operate/feel how we want it to be compared to using "tone generation" often between a (low - high) Hz value that Simvibe and Shakeit use.

    Each tactile option brings its own advantages and disadvantages.


    Soooooooo back to the topic....
    Having more slider controls in ACC for specific effects would very much be appreciated for users to be able to create their own preferred output mix. We often have loads of graphical options but never much control in audio.... o_O
     
    Last edited: Sep 3, 2018
    MjNoisen and chksix like this.
  12. ShredatorFIN

    ShredatorFIN Alien

    That's all fine, but the basic point stands.. if Kunos is able to create 100% realistic audio mix for ACC, by changing the sliders for tactile (or any other) purpose, you make the audio less realistic. For me tactile feedback is 90% about suspension travel, you can't do that with audio no matter how many sliders or EQ you use. Not that having those sliders will kill me, just hope the default values are good so I won't have to touch it
     
  13. Mr Latte

    Mr Latte Racer

    Your making it seem that whatever default audio settings the game may arrive with that these magically represent the ideal "realistic" audio output for all cars.
    We don't need a massive pile of individual effects to control but more than what AC offered would be nice.

    Its very simple, more controls allow a user to determine whatever preference they want.
    Surely thats a good thing and if somebody wants to stick with the default, again the choice is theirs.

    Tactile feedback and the immersion it can generate is about many aspects. Simvibe and the other options mentioned from my perspective in what I monitored via each options controls/outputs, also studied, tested and tried on the very best tactile hardware. Not to be ignorant here but it misses out on so much.

    It is certainly not the best option for feeling what the car's handling is doing as SSW brings superb additional G-force based effect sensations working in the same manner as a GS4 but via tactile. Simvibe is mainly bump/surge orientated with pretty good engine options, much more though is possible.

    Lets stick to audio and not tactile debates, we may not agree and come from different perspectives. I have a specialized build in early progress. I do not boast for the sake of it but understand my position/perspective, it will utilise £4000 worth of tactile units and another £3000 worth of speakers/subwoofers/amps and other audio gear that I have collected over 6 or more years. So for me yes audio in ACC is important as is the tactile immersion I can achieve.
     
    Last edited: Sep 3, 2018
  14. ShredatorFIN

    ShredatorFIN Alien

    Not necessarily, or even likely. Flawless things are hard to achieve. But if the default audio mix of ACC would be flawless, then yes, there's only one correct audio balance. The one real driver hears.
     
  15. Mr Latte

    Mr Latte Racer

    Trying to simulate reality and increasing or maximising immersion or entertainment factors are not necessarily the same thing.
    Immersion is all about utilizing and combining the senses. Sound effect levels, with or without additional EQ, the speaker configuration and quality of speakers used, the make or model of soundcard, or indeed the acoustics of a persons room never mind the users own hearing and preferences are all relevant reasons why it is good to have adjustable options for sound in games.
     
  16. _HUN_Alex

    _HUN_Alex Rookie

    Sorry to interrupt the flow.
    Is there a way to simulate the travel speed of sound (like it was in ARMA 2) so the further the sound source is, the later we will hear it? It would give much more immersion to the free cameras IMO. For example we could achieve something like this: (starts at 0:47) you get the idea.... :)
    I don't know if it was mentioned before.
    P.S.: new to forums, be gentle - (That's what she said..)
     
  17. Epistolarius

    Epistolarius Alien

    Yeah. Realistic, physically based sound propagation would be fantastic to see implemented in a racing game.
     
  18. Dean Ogurek

    Dean Ogurek Alien

    I've wondered why no one has done it yet but, I imagine it's simply too complex. I suspect that it would require a totally new design in audio processing in order to represent a racing environment at that level and the complexity goes way beyond that when we consider sound reflections, occlusion, etc. Plus, it has to be done in a way that can be applied to various views / cameras. Those things have only recently been done for closed spaces on a small scale in some games.
     
  19. _HUN_Alex

    _HUN_Alex Rookie

    Yeah I guess it's not just "calculate the distance between the car and the camera and then delay the sound" :D Maybe one day.... :)
     
  20. FlakNine

    FlakNine Rookie

    Agreed - although I think it should fall in the "nice to have" category! I was at Spa for this year's F1, sat just before the final chicane. The sound delay was really noticeable when cars exited Blanchimont a few hundred meters up the track from us; they were easily clear of the kerb (curb?!) before you heard the very audible buzz of them running over rumble strips at high speed. Obviously GT3 cars aren't running at the speed of F1 but I'd have thought the sound delay would still be apparent.

    If this ever did get implemented, I think it would be OK to only do it in replay mode.
    BTW I think the sound in ACC is absolutely superb - excellent work so far! :)
     
    Last edited: Sep 17, 2018
    _HUN_Alex likes this.
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