1. Do you need support for Assetto Corsa Competizione? Please use the proper forum below and ALWAYS zip and attach the WHOLE "Logs" folder in your c:\users\*youruser*\AppData\Local\AC2\Saved. The "AppData" folder is hidden by default, check "Hidden items" in your Windows view properties. If you report a crash, ALWAYS zip and attach the WHOLE "Crashes" folder in the same directory.
  2. FOR ASSETTO CORSA COMPETIZIONE: If you report issues with saved games, please always zip and attach your entire User/Documents/Assetto Corsa Competizione/Savegame folder!
  3. If your game executable is missing, please add your entire Steam directory to the exceptions in your antivirus software, then run a Steam integrity check or reinstall the game altogether.

Discussing Unreal

Discussion in 'ACC General Discussions' started by el_goe, Sep 13, 2018.

  1. isma_c_r

    isma_c_r Gamer

    All this complicate journey was worthy just with the astonishing rain system, with the track getting more and more water and how the tyres interact with it, the threads that cars create, how the track gets dry and how all this put together implies for strategy, driving, setups...

    In my country we would say "you're complaints are pure vice". This is a hell of a simulator, with all its good and bad things. I can't wait for Kunos to deploy all this ACC in an AC2, with street cars, all the know-how the have gained and stuff.

    I would pay whatever they ask. But please, guys stick to market traditional prices ;)
     
    aotto1977, Thug, cooknn and 1 other person like this.
  2. manuel_rendo

    manuel_rendo Racer

    I have a gtx 1070..and i78700..i have 45 fps,not perfect but playable, with SS 150 and 140 ppd,put it is the lack of sharpness compared with Ac1,iracing,rf2 what it bothers me,the how bad is Antialiasing implemented in Ue&acc due to the limitations with Ue and the blurriness as well even on 1080 p single screen.,
    I can see kunos works hard. to improve but perhaps they have already seen that no matter how hard they work
    There is little room for improvement,hence the comments of Marco in the interview..wether to continue with Ue or not..
    For a niche so specific as Acc only the outstanding makes sense,and if that it is not practical to achieve with a 3rd party,
    Then develop your own one..or at least is what i have understood.

    Rgds
     
    Oblit0r likes this.
  3. chksix

    chksix Simracer

    I remember the original Unreal on the mac :)
     
  4. chavalot

    chavalot Rookie

    Evolution is vulkan.
     
  5. warth0g

    warth0g Hardcore Simmer

    I guess it doesn't matter if they choose to stick with Unreal or go their own way, as long as Kunos continue what they started with ACC. Maybe it's their artists rather than the tech which make ACC look so incredible, in which case it wouldn't matter so much - but i think it's both.

    On a single screen with a decent machine, ACC is beautiful and convincingly realistic. For the minority on triples or VR, I sympathize - but I hope that a minority doesn't kill the sim. Triples seem to me to be on the way out. I'm almost certain that they'll disappear in time, to be replaced by ultrawides or VR. And VR is still very new - it's badly optimized on the current generation of hardware - but it's probably the future. That means that Unreal will, I would have thought, evolve to support it better than it does now. So it makes sense to stay the course and stick with UE.

    One way or another, as one of the lucky ones for whom it runs perfectly, I want the ACC experiment to continue. I had a one hour race with 15 guys yesterday around Spa in the most realistic wet conditions of any sim, bar none. It was incredible and the absolute best racing of my 20+ years sim-racing life.
     
  6. GCCRacer

    GCCRacer Racer

    I suppose as others have said the appeal is being able to license out your engine and thus getting paid for the development efforts in a roundabout way. I.e., the difference of being a studio that creates games versus being a company that enables other studios to create games. Well, that's at least the message I personally would take home from Marco's saying "they want to create technology".
    Kunos as a studio seems to have a pretty top position as far as physics and AI go these days, so sticking with UE means they can't market this knowledge to anyone else.
     
  7. cooknn

    cooknn Hardcore Simmer

    What is that ultrawide monitor Kunos is using in the rigs they have at the race tracks? That thing is bad ***.
     
  8. Coanda

    Coanda Alien

    Samsung CHG90 49" 32:9 @ 144hz @ 3840 x 1080.

    New model just hit the shelf. Sumsung CRG9 49" 32:9 @ 120hz @ 5120 x 1440 :cool:

    Basically 2 x 27" monitors.
     
    hristo1026, LeDude83 and cooknn like this.
  9. warth0g

    warth0g Hardcore Simmer

    Yes it’s the 49” Samsung and it is indeed fantastic. I’ve had one for a few months now and it’s tailor-made for sim-racing.
     
    cooknn likes this.
  10. Rudski

    Rudski Alien

    I find it hard to justify $2,500 bucks for a PC monitor, I suspect sales are low and why the price is astronomical.
     
  11. Coanda

    Coanda Alien

    True. + the 2k GPU to go with it and prob pc upgrade for most.. I have seen them for 1300-1500 US. Id like the 1440p version however it's the full pc rebuild that is really putting me off for now as I would like to wait and see what the next gen GPU's are like.. either way it's a sh!t load of cash.. :(:eek:
     
    LeDude83 likes this.
  12. henkjansmits

    henkjansmits Simracer

    2500? Triples give you better FOV for half of the price. As long as you don't angle them that much, e.g. angling them at a bit more than a curved ultra wide, the distortion is not that bad.

    If you buy 2 ultrawides you can have the bezel in the middle and pretend it's the halo.
     
  13. Captain Barracuda

    Captain Barracuda Hardcore Simmer

    Time's have changed a bit with tech recently unfortunately. Flagship items just keep occupying new price tiers above the existing products rather than the old gear dropping a price tier (it does happen still, but far more slowly than it used to). Worst offenders for this are ultrawide monitors, graphics cards and mobile phones (my 4 year old Dell u3415w is still available new and is more expensive to buy now then when I bought it!)
     
    [ATF]Shanti and Coanda like this.
  14. LeDude83

    LeDude83 Alien

    Hmmm...dunno if you're just being in a glass-half-empty mood. In spring I had bought a Gainward Phantom 2070 GS for ~590 €. Right now, the same store (mindfactory) sells the thing for ~490. That's a 20 % price drop in half a year, while new top-tier GPUs have occured. Back then, a decent 2080 (not those under-cooled entry level models) was just below 800 €. I bought mine one month ago for only 640 €.
    Monitors are also getting cheaper as new top-of-the-line models pop up. This one is the successor of mine:

    https://preisvergleich.check24.de/g...MIuv-B2ufF5AIVzOR3Ch1DWQmJEAQYASABEgKYx_D_BwE

    It can be had for under 300, which is good value for such a nice wide screen. Mine cost ~500 € about 3 years ago. Monitors only become expensive if you want it all: high res,1440p and more, high refresh, 144 Hz. None of it is "needed" - it's luxury. Even a 1080p screen looks very good if you run some supersampling on it and if the AA is good.

    There's even one recent change that has brought great benefit to the gamer's wallet: NVIDIA supporting FreeSync. Although they only have few officially supported screens, it is expected to work alright on most of them.

    A 49", high res screen is an exceptional piece of HW and not really an indicator for gaming gear becoming more and more pricy. Before buying that, I would - like @henkjansmits - indeed rather buy triples and angle them only slightly, or not at all. 3*FHD 24" will make for a nice setup that can be ran even with an RTX2060s or even weaker GPUs.
     
    Last edited: Sep 10, 2019
    [ATF]Shanti likes this.
  15. Rioku

    Rioku Racer

    I prefer Kunos spend their 100% time to the racing part.
     
    ▣ HiTzz and SylverFyre like this.
  16. esox71

    esox71 Alien

    Apparently they monitors have a very bad build quality, loads of people getting them with 20 dead pixels on some.
    Samsung doesn't want to know about it too.
    Heavy banding and colour problems.
     
  17. Skybird

    Skybird Alien

    VR player here. All in all thew grapohics' tehcncial quality are okay, but one cannot ignore that there are minor issues that just allow the user to overlook mthem, since they are no too severly. Mostly the ghosting effect, which i cannot avoid completely no matter how I change settings, in some situations with certain contrast and brightness conditions are quite prominent. All in all the colour palette and crispiness (for VR standards) in AC1 is slightly better. However, night, weather and lights work very good in ACC.

    I would nhot complain if netx time they again do an in-house engine that is specifically tailored to the needs of their project. The big breakthrough U4E was not, at leats not in VR. Its okay, its fine, but not the real big kick-off.

    How that is to be balanced against the difficulty they reported in the past to get the engine to doing what they< want it to do, only Kunos knows for sure. Possible that the engine demands to much workload for tuning it - but for too little gain (in ACC in VR).
     
  18. alex bonner

    alex bonner Racer

    The way I see it is if Kunos stick with UE then they have to remove some features us sim racers need. UE made ACC easier to make within the time frame allowed.

    AC1 was great, they are capable of doing it alone.
     
    Oblit0r likes this.
  19. Ace Pumpkin

    Ace Pumpkin Alien

    As I read here about pop up shadows several times, I see them in every sim. AC, rF2, AMS et al. All show this phenomenon. Don’t know why, because it might be impossible to fix right now?

    As for dropping UE4, I think Stefano is a bright and crafty fellow. After his comments on the workload getting it to work, and the recent interview Marco did at Simracing Expo, I think Kunos is boiling with ingenuity behind the scenes.
    ;)

    Good luck and god speed.
     
  20. Lord Kunos

    Lord Kunos His master's voice. Staff Member KS Dev Team

    welcome back :)

    the one and only technique available for "sun shadows" right now is CSM (cascade shadow mapping).. and that's what everybody uses.
    The idea is to divide the visible scene in a series of shadow map to cover it. Because different part of the scene will be covered by a different shadow map, and that shadow map has to cover more and more space the more far is from the camera there will be a change in shadow resolution between different "cascades".

    The best thing engine can do is to make this transition as smooth as possible without wasting pixels (overlapping portions of shadow maps are a "waste").. UE4 is pretty exceptional in this but it can't cure the worst possible scenario with the guard-rails and the shadow that is "following" the camera.. it's definitely waaaay smoother than AC1 (that used 3 cascades and no smoothing/overlap) but the difference is so big that it's impossible to ignore.

    The other problem that we see in ACC is trees.. and it has nothing to do with CSM shadowing per-se and more to do with the fact that in order to have full blown 3D trees these also need to be heavily lodded (switched to a lower resolution model) in the distance or the framerate will crawl to a stop.
    The "shadow popping" we see is simply trees going from a lod where the leaves were not actual 3D triangles to a more detailed one with 3D leaves and branches.. because of this now there are lots of shadows where before there was none (because the tree was a simplified version with few triangles).

    so ya, they are pretty much present in every game out there with a variable time of the day and outdoor scene.. possibly made less obvious by the fact that you don't get fast moving objects in close proximity with shadow receiver as it's the case with racing games.
    AFAIK there's no real alternative to CSM... something was attempted some years ago with techniques belonging to a base idea called VSM but they come with so many gotchas and corner cases than no games used them. again AFAIK.

    Sadly it looks like something we'll have to live with until raytracing becomes viable.

    For the technically inclined here's a link to a description of CSM:
    https://developer.download.nvidia.c...aded_shadow_maps/doc/cascaded_shadow_maps.pdf

    and VSM:
    http://developer.download.nvidia.co...ceShadowMapping/Doc/VarianceShadowMapping.pdf
     
    ▣ HiTzz, PolarClaw, Ak1504 and 23 others like this.
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