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Incentive for all players to increase their ratings

Discussion in 'ACC General Discussions' started by Max Doubt, May 1, 2019.

  1. Minolin

    Minolin Staff Member KS Dev Team

    Thanks very much - yes, this is the story. If you have any ideas how to make that quite subtle approach more... clear, I'll gladly follow :D

    Mh not too sure about that. You are capable of self-reflection, so I'd be surprised if you end up with a bad SA in the end ;)
    And then - we don't know how much driving you had in this one week - 70 is not 90 or 98, cleaner drivers arrived there within a few days. And 80 is not 14% more/cleaner than 70 SA, it's more like 70% "more".
     
  2. jpeixe

    jpeixe Gamer


    Ok! Thanks for your feedback!!!! ;)
     
  3. martcerv

    martcerv Alien

    I really don't see any need to give people more incentive to play in unrestricted servers, that's already what most do. I think the incentives should be the other way around to try get people into restricted servers and get the newbies an incentive to rate themselves up to get into the better servers. Even getting them to learn to race with AI is a much better thing then in open public servers, sure if you get lucky it can be ok but more often then not it isn't.

    If most are in open servers there is no need for people in there to try and race cleaner as that's where most of the racing is anyway and ratings mean nothing. Yet those "good" drivers in there are so worried about their ratings always when it makes no difference to them either as they just race on open servers, everyone hitting everyone in there makes no difference and its just like an open server in every game ever. Most in there for some reason expect this to change or be better because of the ratings they aren't using in any way to join these servers. :oops: Get more into restricted servers and more people will want to join these and the only way to do say is race cleaner so surely that's better for everyone then allowing "better" drivers a free pass in unrestricted servers.

    Exactly this, I have had an SA 50 server up for weeks and the only people in there have been friends.
     
    PiretSS2000 likes this.
  4. martcerv

    martcerv Alien

    That's kind of where I think most are confused they seem to think 50 is the holy grail but really if you find it easy to get to 80 then why would you really want to race in servers where people cant manage this easily. I wonder what percentage of people are rated over 50 as it seems many avoid these servers, some join and see its still not perfect so they abandon the idea entirely and go back to open servers. When really they should try higher rated servers to see where the level really cleans up.
     
  5. MakeMeLaugh

    MakeMeLaugh Simracer

    No we don't, that's not matchmaking, that's a lobby system with a sorting system. And it's very far from working well.
     
    XettMan likes this.
  6. Minolin

    Minolin Staff Member KS Dev Team

    would love to stick here, but work needs to be done. Let me drop two possibly helpful charts instead, I know you love data :D

    upload_2019-5-1_15-16-17.png

    upload_2019-5-1_15-15-54.png

    Looking at SA server requirements, this is how many drivers beat levels 50, to 100 SA requirements. 50 are several thousands, 100 is 9 drivers.
    upload_2019-5-1_15-21-24.png
     
    tabis, Dookie, AchillesXI and 15 others like this.
  7. iVG

    iVG Alien

     
  8. Raklödder

    Raklödder Simracer

    That explains why there's no SA/95+ servers as of yet, keep at it folks, practice makes perfect.
     
    martcerv, tjr and D.Jankovic like this.
  9. D.Jankovic

    D.Jankovic Alien

    I am amazed how many people have even not unlock SA..wow (if i got that first chart right)
     
  10. Minolin

    Minolin Staff Member KS Dev Team

    well it's important to always put the active vs. total players/owners into perspective. Quite normal, as a reference two interesting AC1 Achievements

    upload_2019-5-1_16-13-6.png
     
    AchillesXI and D.Jankovic like this.
  11. tjr

    tjr Hardcore Simmer

    Yeah, a real eye opener!
     
  12. Oblit0r

    Oblit0r Alien

    Ok, maybe this sounds stupid...

    Seeing how many people have not even unlocked SA rating (assuming a lot of them do race online), would it not be possible to let SA rating get unlocked before PC rating and make it so that if you go online you can get a negative rating (red numbers maybe?) when you crash into people too much. They'd then have to race the AI to increase their rating to >0 (also making it so that the SA rating can't drop below 0 when racing vs AI).
    Set a minimum SA rating to 0 to all non-passworded servers, and maybe give server hosts an option to allow negative-rating drivers?
    This can maybe filter out any deliberate wreckers?
     
  13. positron

    positron Rookie

    I'm surprised about the high percentage of unlocked SA but not surprised so see that there are many players with unlocked SA. I started with simracing early this year and getting PC to 50 was the most difficult part for me. It's still at 52 while SA is now at 81. Based on my personal experience I would suggest to switch SA and PC dependencies. This means slower drivers can still benefit from the SA rating teaching them to become safer drivers. This would also send a clear message that safety is more important than hotlap speed for good drivers.
     
  14. henkjansmits

    henkjansmits Simracer

    Given the data my suggestion is to "unlock" SA before / at the same time as PC. That might lower the barrier and get more "safety" aware drivers at the same time.

    Sorry: already mentioned in post before (hence good idea :) )
     
    PiretSS2000 likes this.
  15. D.Jankovic

    D.Jankovic Alien

    Yea this in AC always amazed me..like simple damn achivements and still nothing.. there is one game that has an achivement just start the game and not even that is 100% obtained :D :D (probablly people who likes to mess stats up :D)

    and on this note.. I CAN NOT WAIT to see what kind of achievements we will get for ACC
     
  16. baakstaff

    baakstaff Racer

    Agreed, while there's definitely value in having the ratings guide drivers towards better racing, having a percentile/leaderboard based rating as a barrier might not be the best way to introduce that. With drivers at ratings of 50-80 potentially trying to constantly improve, it continually sets the bar higher to reach a PC of 50

    Since there is such a thing as being so slow that you're a danger to other drivers, a good alternative baseline could setting the "bar" for reaching 50 PC to whatever the AI are capable of (what skill level AI should be used, I have no clue). After all, if you can't keep up with the slowest AI, you won't be able to drive safely or race them either, making grinding the SA and RC ratings impossible.

    So the PC rating could work like this:
    Have the leaderboard and ratings split into two brackets; those below 50 PC, and those above 50 PC. 50 PC and above unlocks SA just like normal.

    0-49 PC = the drivers who haven't beaten the target time set by a low skill AI (the bare minimum expected for being able to race against the AI and build SA and RC rating).
    51-99 PC = the drivers who beat the target time in order to unlock later ratings. A player in this bracket will never see their rating drop below 50; it would only mean their the slowest of the players that beat the lower target time.
    50 PC = reserved for drivers who have cleared the target time in a past event, but not in a current one.

    After all, if the AI are worth building SA and RC against, then the players should at least be able to keep up, right?

    Having PC gained in the special events is fine, since it's something you only need to succeed in once; the problem is the high bar the "average" player sets for new players. After you've unlocked SA, it doesn't matter if you never do another event. Sure your PC will drop as new events come, but since it has no impact on your TR, SA or RC ratings, you'll never be barred from a server by PC unless you aren't fast enough to drive a safe lap to begin with.

    As for how the decay of PC would work, I figure those who cleared the bar once shouldn't have to prove it again;
    - Any driver with more than 50 PC that doesn't take part in a new event has their PC dropped to 50. The slowest driver who clears the target AI time can have PC 51, and the rest of the drivers scale up from there.
    - Any driver with less than 50 PC can see a similar decay rate to what's currently implemented, since they still haven't proven themselves to begin with.
     
  17. Minolin

    Minolin Staff Member KS Dev Team

    Actually no. My Steam Library is full of stuff I didn't even install yet.
    "That looks fun, I need to try that once I have time"
    "Damn that price is theft"
    "I love those guys, need to support them"
    "Hate the genre, but their complex model looks neat, have to support that"

    and so on
     
    XettMan, Dookie, ▣ HiTzz and 3 others like this.
  18. Poguinhas

    Poguinhas Alien

    I was wondering if it would be possible to have a system that penalizes dangerous rejoins. It's just amazing how many people go off track, then just rejoin with no concern for who may be coming behind.
    Something like: If you are involved a collision within 5 seconds after you rejoin the track, you get an additional SA penalty.
     
    andrea.chiovato likes this.
  19. Zanza21

    Zanza21 Racer

    Thougt bout that even before writing the first post, but had no cleaver enough idea to share.
    In my case a short explanation of the idea behind the srv list sorting wud had done the trick, but prolly a symbol near very high affinity server or very bad ones cud help more?
    Or a % of affinity near each one ?
    Or the first servers highlighted somehow ?
    Something pointing out its not random or bug related but the system itself trying to do its work?
    Dunno really

    That leave me puzzled really. With 70% more safe you mean having 70% less obwp/trust rateo ?
     
  20. D.Jankovic

    D.Jankovic Alien

    valid point

    Humble bundle also :D got so many stuff there i never tried
     
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