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Let's talk Lotus 98T

Discussion in 'Chit Chat Room' started by chakko, Feb 17, 2017.

  1. chakko

    chakko Alien

    One of the very few cars i dislike in AC. It looks lovely on onboard videos from the times when it raced in F1. But in AC, i just don't get a good feeling with it. The FFB feels very "light" with it, and the bounce of the rear seems a bit artificial... mod like. I had high expectations when i drove it the first time, and thought i would enjoy it as much, or more, as the Lotus 72D, or the Ferrari 312T. But, nope, never really vibed with it.

    What is your opinion about it?
     

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  3. chakko

    chakko Alien

    Also check this:



    And note, how James Hunt also states that the steering must feel quite heavy on the car. Don't feel that in AC. Feels much too light. I'd expect it to feel more like the Lotus 72D.
     
  4. Trezoitao38

    Trezoitao38 Simracer

    I disagree. For me the Lotus 98t shows to me Assetto Corsa the best sim for open wheeler cars, I think the same with the Lotus Exos 125 and the two F1 Ferraris of Kunos. Better than overall mods.

    And this car on Mugello is pure crazyness.
     
    TDS likes this.
  5. chakko

    chakko Alien

    I agree that AC is the best open wheeler simulation (i like all the other open wheelers). If only i could love the Lotus 98T, i'm really trying too. :( Saying that, i haven't tried it yet with the V10 tyres. Maybe it has changed for the better for me.
     
  6. Its got way too much grip tho.
     
  7. flyingpig

    flyingpig Hardcore Simmer

    Not my favourite car in AC, but it sure is the car I`ve had most fun in.

    For maximum lunacy, download the excellent Bridgehampton track, max the boost, and keep the loud pedal down through the corners. It`s absolutely exhilarating.
     
  8. yusupov

    yusupov Alien

    not sure why you'd make this thread before trying it after its had a revision...

    anyway, 'light' compared to what? i just drove it & the 312t back to back; it's heavier than the ferrari. i may even be clipping w/ the 98T at equivalent settings, or at least on the edge, bc for me it could feel quite numb, certainly compared to that video. maybe its accurate to the car or the defalt setup, idk.. speaking of car setup, if you watch the video of senna's qualifying lap @ adelaide you can see how much his car was bottoming out. that may explain some of dumfries corrections. anyway, it felt a bit floaty to me but certainly not light, especially at speed.

    it's also an entirely different animal from the early-mid '70s cars, which are going to slide around some. there must've been unprecedented amounts of aero downforce in '86...the drag was certainly immense. 2:1 power to weight ratio & senna could only hit 330km/h at monza.
     
  9. yusupov

    yusupov Alien



    go to 1 hour 18mins in. 55 glorious seconds & then a portent of things to come...
     
    DaveS78 and fbiehne like this.
  10. yusupov

    yusupov Alien

    noticed something weird, AC's car physics only shows 4.0 bar boost @ 100%, which is closer to race than qualifying levels if accurate.
     
  11. Isn't there just a 0.5 bar missing then? If I remember correctly regulations said 5,5 absolute bar. Can be wrong though.

    Edit: And it seems like I was wrong. :)

    From Wikipedia:
    "Power figures for this period of F1 history are largely speculative as most engine manufactures freely admitted that their test beds would not have a sufficient power rating to measure the 1.5 litre turbos output at above 4 bar boost. It is claimed that the Renault EF15B in its pinnacle increment produced around 1200 HP at unrestricted boost pressure, thus making it one of the most powerful engines ever used in Formula 1 history. "
     
    Last edited: Feb 17, 2017
  12. Berniyh

    Berniyh Alien

    If you've got a light FFB, you likely tuned down the FFB strength for it. That happens if you use FFBClip to tune the FFB for the individual cars.
    The thing is that due to the high downforce you will run into clipping situations much more often than for lower downforce cars and thus FFBClip would tune the FFB strength down more or at least would suggest it.
    For me, the auto mode around Nords ended up at around 40% FFB gain, while other cars were more in the range of 60-80%.
    Thus, I think to get a clipping free, strong FFB, you need a strong wheel (DD wheel, maybe CSWv2). Otherwise you will just have to live with clipping or a low FFB gain.

    Apart from that, the 98T is definitely a bit easier to drive on v10 tyres, but still it does require one to adapt the driving style.
    While in most cars you can go in Felipe-Massa-Mode over any curbs you see, in this one the fastest way is often to avoid them completely.
    The reason for that is that this car is a ground-effect car and thus creates huge amounts of downforce through the underfloor. If you lift that off the ground (read: drive over a curb), you lose downforce and thus the car might get unsettled.
    Due to the ground-effect, this effect is more pronounced than in modern F1 cars.

    Edit: Attached my replay file from yesterdays short hotlap run around Nords.
    Keep in mind that that was only my second lap in the car in about half a year or so and also didn't adjust the setup yet for v10 tyres.
    Pretty sure I can go faster, because half a year ago I did a 7:08 there at 96% grip (ALOOG6 event).
    But it should give you an idea how to drive the car, if you're interested.
    Also sorry, can't make a video out of the replay, because somehow I fail to find working settings to record replays. :(
    I hope I can resolve that soon.
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Feb 17, 2017
  13. mantasisg 2

    mantasisg 2 Alien

    I like 98T a lot, as well as many other cars. But I just can't "just" drive it, I have to prepare for it, switch to higher focus mode. Even in simulator it is not so easy to let yourself to hit curves THAT fast, because it can make it, and it isn't easy to believe it.

    I'm not the best one to judge 98T, because I was mostly hotlaping it at Brands hatch on high grip with qualification tyre compound, trying to climb higher in RSR fastest laps lol

    I wouldn't say that it is faster now, but it seems to be less load sensitive, I can mash the throttle with more confidence now, less carefully. Thats about Q compound. I improved my Brands PB by 0.5s even though I was quite tired at a time, and it is not exactly the car which you drive when tired, I was constantly turning too early at Hawthorne bend, it can do it full throttle if you can react :D

    I think it is awesome to race 98T AI
     
  14. Atle Dreier

    Atle Dreier Alien

    If you think the L98T FFB is weak you're doing something wrong. It's by far the most dynamic car in the game, but you have to have the equipment to enjoy it. It's pay to play in this car. It's the only car that bring my OSW close to clipping. It is also the car I use to demo Assetto Corsa to friends who want to try out the direct drive wheel. It peaks at around 44N of force at the rim with my current settings, and that is substantial. It's aslo one of the cars that keep most of the "feel" even in high downforce situations, and it feels amazing. You feel every bump and nuance even when the car is literally squashed ito the ground by air and inertia. One of my favourite cars, but my brain can't keep up with it for long, and neither have I got the stamina for it. How they drove full race distances with these cars is a riddle.
     
    Trezoitao38 and cerebralvortex like this.
  15. Trezoitao38

    Trezoitao38 Simracer

    The ground effects cars were banned for 1982 season. The Lotus 98t have a diffuser only behind the rear axle. Works similar nowadays F1 cars.

    What this car have different is the mufler below the diffuser. The nowadays cars, have the mufler above the diffuser.

    I remember Aris or other Kunos member staff saying something about this, the car can suddenly loose the downforce.
     
  16. Dessu

    Dessu Racer

    Tested it yesterday and the FFB feels quite light, but gets heavier on fast speeds as i would expect.
     
  17. chakko

    chakko Alien

    Thanks guys. I'll give it another ride the next days. Maybe i get some more "feeling" then. :)
     
  18. Trezoitao38

    Trezoitao38 Simracer

    Changes on 1.12.1 for 98t:

    - Fixed Lotus 98T yellow tyre wear indicator on new tyres.
    - Updated Lotus 98T performance envelope by tyres, diffuser and front wing ride height sensitivity and other changes.
     
  19. yusupov

    yusupov Alien

    im still curious about the boost; is aris a skeptic or is it a workaround? @Aristotelis if he has time
     
  20. ziozeus

    ziozeus Racer

    - Updated Lotus 98T performance envelope by tyres, diffuser and front wing ride height sensitivity and other changes

    To everyone
    Please try this car again if you love it as a classic.
    Now it's no longer an airplane in fast turns and not that much sensitive to aero changes in the front wheels with different velocities as before, which made it so difficult to find a car balance in the setup for the different turns in the various tracks.
    Also you have more grip and more front tyres feeling in slow turns
    Really another car.
    A car, indeed. A car you can drive for real.

    Really beautiful!
    I think I will drive this a lot now.
     
    Trezoitao38 likes this.
  21. Trezoitao38

    Trezoitao38 Simracer

    So, you put more or less downforce on front wings?
     

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