Oversteering in FWD touring cars

Following the discussions on the last pages of this thread, basically: https://www.assettocorsa.net/forum/index.php?threads/kunos-a-modern-fwd-touring-car-maybe.45695/

Another great example of too high cornering speed oversteer, and how twitchy these cars can get on the limit (and, generally how twitchy cars get in RL, when you corner too fast):

 

Well it's a Civic, what do you expect? Probably lost a rear wheel

 

Actually, i looked twice in the mirror that there wasn't a car behind him which touched his right rear. I love that oversteer though. I want too.

 

If you want oversteer just stiffen the rear roll bar & springs, it's not hard. And toe them out, that helps cause random violent oversteer too.

FWD touring cars run intentionally very twitchy setups because they can't oversteer with throttle, it's really not representative of how cars in general will handle, just the things necessary to make a FWD fast in a race.

 

With my setup the Abarth 500 AC oversteers a lot under braking with wing 0. At quite a few tracks I have to use 1 or 2 wing to keep the rear in check.

 

As I commented in your last thread on the same subject, it happens in AC too!

 

Yea but you touched the curb...

And the real life vid is barely a corner.

 

Is there something else going on there though, maybe a tyre going down?

 

I don't know. Might be. On the other hand, with too much steering input, in real life, you simple get oversteering (or, of course, depending on the weight load, the weigh ratio, and the track elevation, understeer). I believe when Stereo says that it's partly a setup thing to a degree, but, it's just natural physics. And something which, IMO, in some sims is a bit too dumbed down/good-natured.

I used to watch a lot of BTCC in the late 90's/early 2000's, and they oversteered a lot. Or went haywire under heavy braking. Check this out, completely on the ragged edge:



Ok, pretty whacky tires compared to nowadays, i guess, still, i think it's visible that it's really, really twitchy.

 

Too much steering input in FWD would NEVER equal oversteer. I'm not saying this to sound cool on the internet. To sound like I know what I'm talking about. I'm talking about years of rallying/rallycross and many track events in FWD cars.

Too fast into a corner with too much lock, you're going forwards (understeer)

To get the rear to move you have to play with the weight of the car, you have to bring the weight forward onto the front and this lets the rear slide. The easiest way to do this is to let off the throttle after you've turned in. This is exactly what happens to the Honda Civic in the first video, he rolls off the accelerator, the weight shifts and the rear comes around, he made a bit of an over correction and so had a second slide which he could not hold.

 

Proper FWD can be quite fast, but they're hard to drive. Almost no one runs proper setups in real life at the amateur level... Just understeery dogs. Here's how it should be:

 

Actually, he does accelerate, when the car goes loose.

 

Yes, to pull himself out the slide.

But, you're all right. I'm wrong. Real fwd cars oversteer so much more. I'll leave quietly.

 

Please, don't. Let's discuss, rather. (and please don't think i dismiss your input and experience, i really don't) I do think that you are wrong in this case though. He accelerates, and then slides, because he's too fast into the corner. IMO.

 

I can't be bothered to get some new footage of a massive slide but these minor slides kept happening on Saturday at Silverstone National with rear wing set to 1. I was having real problems at Brooklands and Luffield with the rear trying to step out under braking. I've had major oversteer in this car at RBR National through Rindt corner in MP before.

 

Hey Andy,

ok, but that is oversteering under braking, what i was rather after is corner oversteer, the type when you're cornering too fast/steering input is too much. The video i linked in the OP, but also the video i linked in post #9 show that very well, IMO.

 

Has the driver recovered enough to comment yet or the team? It looks like a bit of a strange crash.

 

In the vid pretty sure that was a puncture. Same happened in the race to someone else and the guy flipped.

 

Heh, you can tell how stiff it is in the rear, the inside tire lifts off the ground at turn-in.

 

Doesn't sound like it: http://www.tcr-series.com/index.php/news/item/tassi-escapes-from-heavy-shunt-at-the-salzburgring

It says that he lost control under braking, but, you can see in the video that his left foot isn't on the brake at the moment he begins drifting. Video here: http://www.tcr-series.tv/2017-salzb...nboard-camera-driver-inunjered_56fff7313.html