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CARS The Audi R8 LMS GT3

Discussion in 'ACC Blog' started by Aristotelis, Jun 4, 2019.

  1. Aristotelis

    Aristotelis Will it drift? Staff Member KS Dev Team

    The Audi R8 GT3 is undoubtedly one of the dominating cars of the Blancpain GT3 series.
    It’s not just that it constantly scores pole positions, fast laps and overall wins in practically every circuit. It gets these results with almost any team and any driver using it. This is the proof that the Audi R8 is a very capable car, always efficient and fast.

    You’d been forgotten to think that the Audi R8 is a Lamborghini Huracan GT3 in disguise, or vice versa. After all the cars have the same chassis and the same engine. The wheelbase is also identical. But this is where the similarities end. There are differences in suspension geometry, there are differences in the engine tune and power delivery and there are many differences in the aerodynamic efficiency and performance. It is evident by the base setups of the car, that are quite different from the Huracan counterpart.
    The Audi usually likes stiffer rear end, it helps it rotate it and it maintains the rear suspension movement under control. Even the rear antiroll bar is pretty stiff as it keeps under control the, lack of, camber gain when the car rolls. A good amount of negative static camber helps.

    Obviously when you drive the car, some traits are similar. The power delivery, the electronics, the sound… all things that are truly very similar to the Lamborghini. But then, the differences start to come up to the surface. At turn in the car wants to oversteer like the Huracan but does gives a bit more confidence while doing it. At mid turn and exit the front end is willing to follow the steering inputs better. This means the engineer is not forced to use extreme setup to rotate the car and the driver doesn’t have to abuse the car to follow the line. All in all, where the Huracan is on the edge, the Audi seems more composed and steady. I won’t say it inspires confidence, because it really doesn’t when pushed to the limits, but you have a better idea of where the limit is, or at least that’s the impression.
    Is this a better car than the Huracan? Well no, it’s different. The neutral handling in mid turn will bite hard at you when you try to ride kerbs. You can compromise, you can set the car more stable and it works, but if you really want to go fast then watch out riding the inner kerbs. The car will rotate fast and at the very best case scenario you will lose lot’s of time trying to control it. Otherwise you’ll spin out of the track with your tyres flatspotted and many places lost. It’s best to approach turns with a V line. Brake late and go for an early apex without turning it too much to keep the rear end stable. Once you’ve passed the early apex and the speed is slower, rotate the car fast, away from the kerb and point to a second late apex and a straight exit, taking advantage of the rear weight bias traction. This kind of turn approach keeps the mid engine architecture traits under control. Great agility and grip, nasty behaviour when unsettled.

    The engine seems a bit less powerful than the fastest Huracan team, which is strange because it should be the same engine, but the feeling is that it is more docile at power application out of the corners at the expense of a somewhat slower acceleration. We’re talking really minimal differences though.

    Audi’s great experience in the LMP1 category has paid dividends in the car’s aerodynamic efficiency. As a matter of fact the rear wing comes straight from the LMP1 car design and it has very well documented aero map so it needs less adjustments to be efficient and helps the teams by avoiding unnecessary complexity. The results are evident as the Audi is always on the top of max speed traps at high speed circuits, without losing much downforce. This is indeed a great advantage in the middle of a race. Not only the car can keep up in terms of handling and overall grip, but it can also get out of the slipstream and still keep accelerating, obtaining a great position before the braking zone. If you feel uncomfortable with the aero balance of the car, you can always add a bit of rear wing, confident that your top speed will still stay competitive with the other cars.

    Another advantage of having so many cars on the grid, by so many different teams, is that there is a lot of knowledge regarding the car, its traits and the setups needed to go fast. Information does go around in the Blancpain paddock and when the “Audi armada” decides to attack, the combined knowledge does give a competitive advantage.

    So is the Audi the car the car to chose if you want to win? It is a good candidate, and with the help of somewhat surprisingly favourable BoP, it can win on almost every track, but it’s not alone and if other cars push it to choose different racing lines, it might show its ugly face. Be sure that there are other cars out there that can really push it to its limits.


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  3. pazzi008

    pazzi008 Racer

    Yup, can confirm it hates kerbs :D way more "easy" than the lambo IMO
    F430_458_F12 and Stickdeath1980 like this.
  4. ignission

    ignission Racer

    I love these blog posts, they are always a great read. Thanks for taking the time to post them @Aristotelis :)
  5. theivansk

    theivansk Gamer

    Love it. Make the threat sticky to never lose it!
  6. Coanda

    Coanda Alien

    Thank you Aris! smooth moves once again :cool:
  7. Diablo_rf

    Diablo_rf Hardcore Simmer

    I wonder if the car does avoid inner kerbs IRL as much as it should do in the sim, or is just a matter of "PLEASE ASSETTO, FIX THE KERBS, JUST FIX THE KERBS DAMNIT" :D
    From my own experience, the audi is indeed more confortable to drive than lambo. Less stress and more confidence in the car. But in the rights hands lambo still can outdo the audi, because of more grip.
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2019
  8. On YT I heard from race drivers testing ACC (Nicki Thiim, Jan Seyffarth), that the wheelbase is longer than in the Lambo. Now I'm confused.
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2019
    Madsen likes this.
  9. pazzi008

    pazzi008 Racer

    The 2019 r8 LMS have a wheelbase longer by nearly 50mm than the huracan GT3, not sure about the one we have in game (2015 model?) but probably similar to the 2019 one. Now I'm not sure if 5cm really can make a difference in a GT3 car

    Fonts: random google research, didn't find official measurements online
  10. I need to find a way to stabilize a kurbs touches... some softer rebounds maybe?

    @Aristotelis we need a tuning guide too lop
  11. exited22

    exited22 Gamer

    @Aristotelis Thanks again for the detailed write up. Always fascinating to read what the engineers did to make the car good and fast, but also where they needed to make a compromise and how this compromise it affecting the overall handling.

    I was a little bit surprised, that you wrote that the car follows the steering input precisely from mid corner to exit. I read some months ago in a detailed analysis of the R8 GT3 Evo in German magazine Sport Auto that Markus Winkelhock said that the formel model (the non evo) had always massive issues with push understeer at the corner exit while accelerating. Also I remember that he said that the car was pretty nervous on corner entry and often they had to deal with snap oversteer.
    Can you confirm that car behaviour? :)

  12. Great car, I tried it briefly for the first time yesterday and given how I feel about the Huracan I was pleasantly surprised when I fired up the Audi for a few laps. Watched a Nicky Thiim stream and he reckons the Lambo has a slightly shorter wheelbase.

    Anyhow, glad it's different proving my preconceptions wrong. Looking forward to winning some races in this car.
  13. Raklödder

    Raklödder Simracer

    I read that somewhere, but didn't realize they were that close. They both sound great in real life and in game, but I do prefer the R8 onboard. Also thanks for another interesting read.
  14. junneh

    junneh Gamer

    I totally love these posts @Aristotelis

    Can we expect them for all the cars at some time? I want to understand my merc better!
  15. Jerry Atrick

    Jerry Atrick Rookie

    Hi Aristotelis, thank you once again, a great explanation making this a favorable choice; I think this might be my next drive.

  16. Aristotelis

    Aristotelis Will it drift? Staff Member KS Dev Team

    As usual, one of the things you learn by having to deal with drivers during the years, is to take feedback into perspective. When a driver complains that there is no grip, you look at its telemetry data and you see a lower grip by 0.02Gs... But that's their job. They complain to make the car faster to win and that's what the engineers are searching for. Also the engineers described me the car as "terminal oversteer at entry, terminal understeer at exit". You need to know engineering language to understand that by terminal they intend that after all is done in setup, this are the traits the car will showcase. Indeed to go fast you setup the car and it will oversteer at entry and understeer at exit. So does the Lambo even more, but the engineer and the driver do not care for comparisons. They care about what their car does and how to fix it. They won't say "it oversteers a little bit and understeers a tiny bit...". They say, this is our range, we need to make it better.

    I shouldn't show this but it's pretty safe. Homologation and technical manual papers from the manufacturers. As you can see the difference is minimal. In a competitive ambient where half tenth of a second is "a lot", every single thing matters... but again as I said above, you need to take things into perspective when drivers talk. Which if you ask me, is also great and the magic of this world.

    Screenshot 2019-06-04 15.35.45.jpg Screenshot 2019-06-04 15.35.02.jpg
    LeDude83, Coanda, Dookie and 14 others like this.
  17. SimGuy_1

    SimGuy_1 Racer

    Oh i was waiting for this for a long time really appreciate it mate thanks.
    My opinion on Audi V.S lamborghini->
    1.Sound is different.It has less transmission noise and less screaming still i love it(maybe more than lamborghini)
    2.More stable aerodynamically BUT at the same time has less fine tuning on rear wing options than lamborghini so even one click has HUGE effect so in this terms i prefer lamborghini.
    3.More weight and length makes it slightly less agile on turn in phase of slow corners.
    4.Lamborghini has way better in-car details of tyres than Audi i play with all HUD OFF so that huge difference.
    5.Top speed is slightly less than lamborghini as mentioned above.
    Now as far as looks are concerned Lamborghini looks way more angry than Audi.Audi looks Simple(Relatively) but elegant.
    Overall These both cars are SOOOO AMAZING i can't decide which one is better currently lamborghini is Little bit faster on 2 circuits than Audi for me but i'm sure i can achieve same times or even better with Audi.
    Funny thing is i was way more anticipated for Porsche than Audi but Audi came out on Top LOL.
  18. Very cool Aris, thanks for sharing... love these tech blogs
    Aristotelis likes this.
  19. SimGuy_1

    SimGuy_1 Racer

    Just one quick question->>
    Which car has more front weight bias?
    You said in lamborghini post that it has nearly 60% weight on rear so is it same for Audi?
    From my observation Audi may have a slightly more front weight than.
    Even if you can't say number it's fine just saying which one has more front weight bias will do :)
  20. Aristotelis

    Aristotelis Will it drift? Staff Member KS Dev Team

    The Audi has a very very tiny amount of more weight bias.
  21. SimGuy_1

    SimGuy_1 Racer

    That explains why it has slightly more on-throttle oversteer and it doesn't tank slap has hard as lamborghini thanks to it additional front weight and length.
    People hate front weight bias but what i understand that front weight allows front to be more planted on mid speed corners and also allows to get on throttle earlier.
    Thanks for replying really helpful.

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