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The Ferrari SF15-T power unit & driving advice.

Discussion in 'Chit Chat Room' started by Aristotelis, Jul 15, 2016.

  1. DuckeyTapey

    DuckeyTapey Hardcore Simmer

    In some other cars it does say next to it that it's water temperature. It's also labelled so in the telemetry app. It has no effect on engine performance though.
  2. slopps

    slopps Simracer

    well, i did my own review of the car.
    i think for those struggling with the different throttle rates............you're just going to have to get an OSW wheel!
    Andrex, coret3x, Aristotelis and 3 others like this.
  3. lelinuxien52

    lelinuxien52 Racer

    Thank's a lot.

    You're probably right. Normally SOC should be higher when MGU-H are on Battery mode. Maybe a physics bug.
  4. ALO458

    ALO458 Racer

    Got confused a bit with the article about what's real F1 explanations and what not. Apart from the DRS, I guess everything is real or not? Also the aerodynamic part that talks about front wing flexing under load, monkey seats, wing stalling etc. is it also happening in ac ? (I mean are they "functional" in the physics engine? If so, then we got crazy detail there! :D )

  5. Open the Wings App, and look at the AOA (angle of attack) column for each wing, see how it changes with throttle/speed etc.
  6. unknwn

    unknwn Alien

    I cannot enjoy this car with T300 wheel, obviously its too weak to cover the dynamic range of FFB for this car.
    I like the car being edgy/sharp (the physics), but with AC FFB and T300 you either don't feel low speed or clip at higher speeds (depending on FFB force you set).
    This means you have to drive by learning instead of feeling the car through FFB. Car behavior is very dynamic (physics/MGU settings..) which means driving by learning is not the way to go.
  7. APC900

    APC900 Simracer

    It feels very, very good with the T-500 wheel.
    You are constantly micro-correcting with this car to get the best out of it but that's what makes it fun.
    I too, agree with the fact that the FFB 'tells' you what the rear of the car is doing at all times.
  8. ZethGAF

    ZethGAF Simracer

    Try the FFBClip app's "Dynamic" setting. http://www.assettocorsa.net/forum/i...ack-anti-clipping-tool-v4-1-3-bugfixes.14165/
  9. "KERS: As with other cars in Assetto Corsa, the KERS button can be mapped in the SF15-T. This provides an instant “max power” button for use in battles with other cars. Applying the KERS button essentially reflects the following ERS settings:
    • MGU-K regen to 0%
    • MGU-K deploy profile to Hotlap
    • MGU-H mode to Motor"
    But why is MGU-K regen set to 0%, if it only regens when "off throttle (coast) and braking"? It shouldn't matter, right?
    If you're pressing the KERS button, it (should) means that you're 100% on throttle (or any percentage other than 0, for that matter), hence, not in any of the two scenarios that enable MGU-K regen (off throttle (coast) and/or braking).

    Well, it shouldn't matter, UNLESS the system is still introducing some kind of friction to the rear axle/transmission/system thingy, if you have any MGU-K regen other than 0%, and are in any percentage of throttle usage (other than off throttle (coast) and/or braking)...

    So...what gives? :)
  10. shrapnel1977

    shrapnel1977 Melancholia Enshrines All Triumph

    You answered your own question. MGU-K regen is always applying a some level of retardation to the rear axle when engaged so it ultimately can reduce the top speed. When on full throttle this effect is negligible, but if you use the KERS button you want maximum warp and that's what you get.
  11. Very interesting!

    But may I ask where did you get this info from? Dev apps ingame? A thread somewhere?

    (You're refering to a retardation effect simulated in AC, correct?)
  12. shrapnel1977

    shrapnel1977 Melancholia Enshrines All Triumph

    No, I am referring to the car in real life, and all current F1 cars since 2014 (and LMP1). Though I am given to understand that this is mirrored in AC, I am not sure 100%. I wrote the OP of this thread, and the manual for this car which is attached at the bottom of the OP.

    I reserve the right to be wrong as I don't work for Ferrari, and I am sure that if I did work for their power unit division the configurations of their power unit would not be something I could discuss on a public forum. I have, however, heavily researched these systems and spoken to a number of engineers who are very familiar with their operation, not just for this manual for AC, but also in relation to the McLaren-Honda system that iRacing have implemented (which is very similar of course but with different software specifications to the Ferrari SF15-T).

    The MGU-K is geared to the crankshaft of the ICU via the transmission with a small clutch system. When the MGU-K is in regen or delivery this clutch is engaged, when the MGU-K is delivering power this clutch is engaged as the MGU-K provides additional power to the ICU which allows the vehicle to accelerate more quickly. When regen is enabled this clutch is also engaged, to ensure that the MGU-K maintains a constant, high level of rotation for harvesting capabilities. Whilst those harvesting capabilities only come into play under deceleration, the engagement of the clutch when there is a certain regen mode enabled on the vehicle will mean a certain level of energy will be being drawn from the rear axle. I am given to understand that this effect is very small indeed under power, but it is there nonetheless. These are basic fundamentals of the systems that would apply to modern F1 cars or a Toyota Prius, I cannot be sure if any F1 team may have found ingenious solutions to any of these problems (such as smarter software controlling the MGU-K clutch engagement).

    As to why the Ferrari software would disable regen when pressing the KERS button (which in some cars is the Boost button or overtake or whatever), well you'd have to ask them, the AC system mirrors the real life counterpart in terms of what that button does.

    Thinking about it, I doubt very much it is just to offset this small level of MGU-K drag, I suspect it is more based around the idea that a driver may hold the button throughout a braking event and exit of a corner when making a pass.

    If you assume that when you want to press this button you want maximum performance from the car in all areas, then removing any regen effect is part of that equation. With maximum deployment and zero regen the MGU-K is dedicating all of it's energy to the power unit for forward acceleration, and with regen disabled the braking performance of the car will not be balanced against MGU-K recovery in the brake-by-wire system, thus shorter braking distances and more braking stability, which is part of the equation of maximum performance enabled by this button.

    Thus, the button is an "easy access" to maximum performance. If you are running laps with a high level of regen, for instance, and need instant performance for a short period that is when you use it, so that once whatever "move" is completed you release the button and instantly return to the previous software setting you were using, instead of having to reconfigure everything back to where it was.

    Also, this button may be used (probably more often) in defence. If you are being caught by a following car because you are in a regen phase of the race and under reduced performance relative to your immediate competitors, you may not want to switch to a more aggressive delivery mode and upset your overall race plan for ERS management. Thus, as the chasing driver approaches you stick to your plan, and when they arrive on your tail and start to think about a move, you push the button and regain maximum braking performance, thus making it more difficult for them to make a divebomb overtake.

    We saw this last week with Max Verstappen and Kimi Raikkonen in Hungary. When Kimi was a few seconds behind Max's red light was flashing in braking areas denoting that he was in regen, but when Kimi was on his tail and potentially making a move there was no flashing light, because Max will have used his equivalent of the KERs button to maximise his braking performance to keep Kimi behind. Thus sometimes you see these overhead shots of "Wow, that guy is making up tons of time on the brakes" and past experience of pre-2014 F1 makes us (and the commentators which in the UK seem to struggle to understand the ERS systems still!) think this is about tyre performance alone, but then when the chasing driver gets closer it magically appears that the lead driver has found a ton of braking performance from nowhere. But in reality they just have a "turn off regen while I hold this button" system.
    chksix, deni80s, BrunUK and 1 other person like this.
  13. Bit OT but thought this was quite interesting; Someone caught Ferrari weighing their wheels+tyres at Hockenheim today, cool to see how precise they are. I wonder how much mass they lose when worn down at the end of a stint?

  14. Ok, thanks a lot for the answer, very interesting info.
    However, now I have another question, regarding defense strategy, using the KERS button for shortening braking distances:
    Is it not counter productive trying to short braking distance, by actually motoring the rear wheels? I get and obviously agree with the 0% regen state, but if the KERS button is used to give "full" power, if you press it for braking, the 0% regen state will be offset by the KERS power being delivered to the wheels. Am I wrong?

    I went ahead and tested it in AC. Here's the scenario, and here's what happened:

    If you engage a gear, for example 3rd, and you let it stabilize in the corresponding road speed (without pressing any pedal), and then press the KERS button, the car will accellerate. Ok, that's what it is supposed to do. But that tells me that accelerator position is not a factor for KERS deployment, when using the KERS button. So, if you use KERS button for shorter brake distances, you're kinda going the opposite way. I'm confused...

    (However, I did not test to see if using KERS with brake pedal pressed, actually deploys energy. I believe that the error factor of my procedures would just be too big to draw a valid conclusion.)

    I also reserve the right to be wrong :)
  15. I went back and tested the KERS button while braking:

    I was wrong, one can easily tell, actually:

    If you brake and press the KERS button, not only the blue bar lights up, indicating energy being deployed, but you can also feel the car being pushed forward. So my question and confusion still stands.

    (In reality I'm sure it's different. But I drive the AC one ;) )
  16. shrapnel1977

    shrapnel1977 Melancholia Enshrines All Triumph

    That's strange. So if you are off throttle at, say 20kph and you hit the KERS button the car accelerates?

    There shouldn't be any deployment if the throttle is not being pressed at all, it could be a bug, but have you checked to ensure there is no clipping on your throttle axis?
    TheDrivingClub likes this.
  17. fantomas76

    fantomas76 Racer

    Even if you are standstill on the dragstrip in neutral, throttle off, no spikes, if you press the KERS button the car revs up. And then if you engage 1st gear, it starts.

    Inviato dal mio D5803 utilizzando Tapatalk
    TheDrivingClub likes this.
  18. coret3x

    coret3x Simracer

  19. fantomas76

    fantomas76 Racer

    Actually it doesn't start, it moves very slowly with the front wheels locked. This happens with all manually operated KERS cars, Ferrari "F138", "SF15-T" and McLaren "P1".
    TheDrivingClub likes this.
  20. The system used for testing, has a 10% deadzone on the clutch axis, due to previously observed spiking (you can read our intervention in this topic, for more details --> http://www.assettocorsa.net/forum/index.php?threads/engine-hesitations.33607/#post-704858). Now, any spiking observable in the controls menu, is well within the deadzone (about 3% spiking). No apparent spiking is observable in the pedals app.

    We can, however, test the scenario again, in our other 5 systems, just to be sure. But that will have to happen only after the weekend.

    Mind the low speed physics and artificial force used by Kunos, to keep the cars from moving, when they're not moving. (To keep them from rolling up and downhill, when sitting in the garage and such.)
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