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What can fairly be expected of developers trying to create the 'best' racing sim ?

Discussion in 'ACC General Discussions' started by ValseTriste, May 3, 2018.

  1. ValseTriste

    ValseTriste Rookie

    Note: I initially started this thread under another title which was weak and ambiguous, my bad, apologies. I hope that it is well received by all that I start afresh here :)

    Hi all, well as a first post, not only here but ever, this is clearly a broad sweeping subject, perhaps as broad as it could be, but I'm putting myself out there since having discovered AC and having since read through a lot of the posts I felt the need to try and at least offer my thoughts on what really matters regarding a racing sim yet sadly often seems forgotten...

    My modest background is around 25 years of real-world driving experience, no track experience apart from being driven around Brands Hatch Indy by a pro at such enormous speeds in a Lotus 2 Eleven (I believe it was anyway) that I had trouble seeing over the dashboard for most of it, plus on and off sim racing over the years, mostly iRacing and more recently AC.

    So in a nutshell I would like to propose as a permanent reminder that this is all that might really matter and can be fairly expected from a developer when trying to create the best racing sim out there :

    • Firstly and above all an enormously rewarding simulated driving experience based on thorough and passionately researched and implemented software elements, based on real life experience whenever possible, that will inherently always be a tradeoff between reality and usability.
    • Secondly a humanistic community base of developers and users which may lead to ongoing improvements to the sim when advances in technology and knowledge allows.
    • And last but not least the fact that what offers the greatest level of immersion for each of us is naturally subjective ensures that in addition to the developers recommended defaults, the more options there are for those wishing to experiment the better.

    Its a real shame that so many people clearly become absolutely overwhelmed with the notion that a sim, any sim, can and should replicate reality down to the finest detail. It cannot and never will. No sim is perfect, nothing is. Even the most extravagant of professional sim rigs and hardware setups is still absolutely nothing like driving a real car. I empathise with those who do however obsess since admittedly I have moments myself, but they pass.

    Thankfully it is nonetheless true that the level of immersion achieved by sims today is phenomenal, a version of the real thing that is magical.

    In terms of direct comparisons with real life the fundamental differences are the human senses involved and variables since real life is naturally full of them which leads us when making most comparisons with sims to go around and around and around in endless circles. It is an unhealthy waste of time.

    How many of us have real life experience of what we can do for example in AC, concerning the whole package of cars and tracks I would imagine absolutely no-one, most probably even the developers themselves ?

    So basically, to question for example the physics of a specific car, on a specific track, under specific conditions with a specific setup without that exact real life experience is nonsensical and to do so with even less specificity is, well, even worse. But those extreme few who do have the relevant experience (I wish I did as I have huge regrets at never investing in racing lessons, track day experience etc etc) are hopefully vocal about it and will continue to put themselves out there too and try to contribute to the sim, its priceless info to us all !

    The rest of us have to just trust the developers and appreciate the fact that we are lucky enough to have a multi-platform racing experience available to us of this calibre. Surely we all represent either the first or the second example as there is no in-between so, respectfully, if one does go ahead and publicly share an opinion with a negative slant and its entirely fair to do so, it unfortunately won't serve any real purpose or get heard. With at least some effort to empathise with the developers it is also fairly easy to understand why it wouldn't.

    By contributing to the forum myself with this topic I am of course voicing an opinion of my own but hopefully it has an entirely positive slant which in the context of the site would surely always be welcome, get heard and hopefully contribute.

    Happy continued racing to all !

    Last edited: May 4, 2018

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  3. ValseTriste

    ValseTriste Rookie


    Regarding the current AC fundamentally being based on AI and single player use with multiplayer as an option it was arguably much easier to meet the criteria I mentioned above since catering for the needs of everyones subjective preferences was accomplished with a more than reasonable variety of content, solid default options for the purists, car setup options etc, etc so that people could pretty much do there own thing.

    Obviously however, if the upcoming ACC will fundamentally be a multiplayer concept it will of course be practically and philosophically impossible to cater for those same subjective preferences, all ideally wanting to be met for those competing in the same race !

    So all the best to the developers ;) I for one will continue to respect the fact that ideals do not exist but that truly great racing sims full of inherent compromises do and will hopefully continue to evolve...
    Last edited: May 3, 2018
  4. ValseTriste

    ValseTriste Rookie

    I know I can't be the only one who thinks this is a relevant topic worth mentioning but some support as a reminder would be great.

    Indeed any feedback is more than welcome...
  5. BrunUK

    BrunUK Alien

    Your excessive verbosity is quite off-putting. Am also not convinced you're proposing anything worth discussing.
    nate and Poguinhas like this.
  6. ValseTriste

    ValseTriste Rookie

    Brutally honest but fair enough, never been great with words. By starting the thread I was going more for just generating some constructive support for the developers than starting a discussion, well at least I've given it a shot.
  7. Flavus

    Flavus Racer

    Don't take this the wrong way but a lot of people on here are not native English speakers (e.g. Americans :D) and your posts are.... well ....rather long winded and bit difficult to understand . Personally I loose interest in reading your posts after the first or second sentence. I am not trolling you but just giving my honest my opinion.
    As for AC, love it, it ticks all the boxes that I think a sim should have. Is it perfect...no ..of course not... but it is not far off :).
  8. ValseTriste

    ValseTriste Rookie

    Theres nothing to be taken the wrong way, no worries there, my first language is french, second greek and third english but I get your point for sure. Like I said, never been particularly good with words but it is also long winded as I was trying to anticipate the obvious responses from the outset so gave my background, my point, justification etc.

    FAILED, still, happy continued racing to all ! :)
  9. Psit

    Psit Alien

    Απέτυχες... :)
  10. ValseTriste

    ValseTriste Rookie

    Aκριβώς... I will stick to driving :)
    Psit likes this.
  11. Ace Pumpkin

    Ace Pumpkin Alien

    First you force me to use a translator and second it makes no sense....;)
    OP tried hard for a rookie, mind he cannot know.
    We as long time residents know the answer to his question:
    But only a LITTLE LESS.
    In that regard Kunos delivered, massively.
    Only imho of course.
  12. ValseTriste

    ValseTriste Rookie

    If anyone managed to read and understand my original post ;) and it makes them just think twice before posting something then I succeeded...

    I realise how I failed to keep it simple but honestly its the best I can do, like I said I will go back to racing :)
  13. Whipdiddywhip

    Whipdiddywhip Simracer

    replicating good physics isn't enough on its own, there is so much more that goes into the race weekend as a driver, that's where AC fell short

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