Who's at Fault? - Discussing Racecraft and Incidents

You're right, I wish it wouldn't be like that because one driver can easily ruin the experience for many others.
Just for example here @ 1:31:

 

Yeah, the guy in the blue AMG has very poor awareness. He was hit from behind but then done an aweful rejoin into a pack of cars. An example of an idiot that we see online too often.

 

Also I think, he didn't deal well with his too late braking going across the track at the end of the chicane.

 

Hi,

I would like to know your opinions in this case....

 

Hard overtake but still fair imo.

 

Lambo' s initially fault.
The revenge needs no comment.

 

Porsche left the door open. since the Lambo sent it, he couldn't do anything (and Porsche was changing directon during the braking zone too)
also that revenge is childish.

 

Nothing wrong with the overtake. At 13:50 they are side by side and both under control, the Porsche can see the Lambo and cannot turn in on him. The contact and subsequent rub straighten up the Lambo's line otherwise it would have been a clean overtake with some room left for the Porsche .

The Porsche driver spit his dummy out.

 

@long_chicken hard overtake from the Lambo but no dive bomb. The Lambo changed the lane before braking zone and was alongside when braking started. The Porsche behaved childish, instead he should have opened up take a little wider turn and go for the switchback.
The "revenge" foul by the Porsche is worth no comment.

 

Porsche is at fault, but probably just making a dumb mistake.

 

That's what I'm considering as a dive bomb. It's not the fact going to the inside. It's the fact he's going wide at the exit, crossing the line of the Porsche and pushing the other car off track.

 

Yep, as far as the dive bomb question, the Lambo could not have made the corner and left room for the Porsche at the rate the Lambo was going when entering the corner.

But the Porsche moving over and leaning on the Lambo, did not allow the Lambo to turn into the corner, so not so simple here.

 

I dont consider this a dive bomb at all. Lambo managed his braking perfectly, getting completely alongside in the braking zone and would have made the corner exit without contact if the porsche left a bit more room (as he was beaten on the braking zone already). Hell, even with the contact, it was pretty minor anyway, no need to get all pissed off for that.

No way the Porsche driver was taken by surprise by the move, as the Lambo was alongside him pretty much from the beginning of the braking zone.

Interesting to see differing opinion on this subject, the very essence of the thread I guess!

What we can all agree on though, is the revenge bump was totally uncalled for, unless it was a mistake but judging by the impact, I dont think so.

 

No it's not that simple

The Lambo was overshooting the apex by far. @long_chicken was still on the brakes at this point:


Managing perfect braking means staying at the inside of the corner without the need going that wide. At least for me.

This is just the consequence of late braking. He was never alongside before the braking point.

A big fat YES on this one

 

Reason I'm saying its not a dive bomb for me, is that he didn't brake way later than the Porsche but released the brakes right after the initial brake phase to get alongside. I see nothing wrong with that, especially since he was quite close to the Porsche at the end of the straight. A divebomb for me is when the overtaking car is too far away before the braking zone, therefore surprising the overtaken car too much and forcing both cars to be way over the limit. I recently was divebombed from a guy 0.7sec behind...

As for the apex, the door was closed real late by the Porsche so he might have been able to turn in better otherwise. Little contacts like these can upset the car very much resulting in slightly longer braking distance or difficulty at initial turn in, as previously said. Tough one to judge really!

Anyway, I think I would have been upset in both cars in that situation But would have not resorted to revenge

 

The Lambos brakes were still on when he made contact with the Porsche, far too late into the corner, demonstrates the Lambo was in over his head.

Watch the brake lights.

 

People use dive bomb even when it's successful, so I suppose it can mean multiple things. In my head it's when you go inside like in the video but have no chance of actually making the corner, meaning your going to take the other car out no matter what you do.

While I don't think there's anything wrong with the move the Lambo made, it's what happens after the apex. Either he was going to fast and needed the Porsche to keep him on track, or he accelerated early and just bullied his way past. He could have kept slowing down and done a sharper turn so he didn't end up hitting the Porsche, it would take the fight to the next corner where he has a good chance of getting past on the outside.

Poor behaviour from the Lambo, terrible reaction from the Porsche, makes me wonder if there was previous. The Lambo wasn't showing much respect to the Porsche, it looks like one of those moves made out of frustration and foul mood.

 

This is a dive bomb for me. Someone who is by far not in the position to try an overtake, shooting in the corner anyways and taking the opponent by surprise who then mostly not even has a chance to avoid the contact.
Here the Lambo was having a run on the Porsche, very close and changed line to make clear he is going for the overtake. No dive bomb for me.
But I agree the Lambo made the mistake of overshooting the corner.
That's why I said the Porsche should have gone for the switchback, he would have won back his position for sure.

 

It's borderline. Corner is not defended well. Lambo gets aggressive but fair, Porsche then decided to defend a little even though the lambo has managed to get the apex.
If your going to invite a move like this, give up the apex and go for the undercut. Don't try to defend a lost apex.
The move was aggressive, but just about fair.
The Porsche should be aware of aggro moves like this coming off straight. Either take a defensive line to discourage the move in the first place, or have a plan of action if the move comes.

 

Well, I am in the Lambo here....the guy in the BMW says I drove into his line....