Actual road wheel rotation

I love watching the replays in AC they look great, but one thing that looks a bit out of place is the unnatural way the road wheels rotate. Some cars look as though they have different wheels at different speeds.
It's more like a wheel rotation effect in AC?
I see in many older sims and games that they have actual wheel rotation, or some effect that looks exactly like real life.
Will this be something that will change in the future of AC?

 

It happens with every car some are more obvious than others. If you drive from a stand still and watch the wheels as you accelerate you will see the wheels change as speed increases. It looks like you have a different wheel model for different speed ranges and it's obvious when it switches from one to the other.
It's noticeable a lot of the time when the car is speeding up, slowing down, or adjusting the throttle in a drift. Also it looks like the rear wheels are still rotating when you pull the handbrake. The lotus elise is probably the easiest to see it on.

 

Here is an example of it.

 

you do have different model, that's how "motion blur" works, there's no fast way to render motion blur, so they used blurred version of the wheel ( with blurred texture) and at certain speed they swap it out

 

That's what I thought. So what is wrong with just having one wheel model and making it rotate at the appropriate speed?
It seems a bit simpler than making different wheel models to me, considering that's how it seems to be done in older sims.

 

to create motion blur effect on it it's quite costly,

i'm not familiar with latest shaders of course, so I don't know how it can be done using newest shaders and what the actual performance hit would be, but if this was needed for every car, I can imagine that you could easily lose 10 fps or so,

in older sims it was done the same way, but maybe there was more in between steps ( not just 2 wheel models, but maybe 3 or 4) so that the transition is smoother, but pretty much all older games definitely use the same system

 

Hi.

I'm curious which sims you mean. AFAIK blurred wheel textures is the way its generally always been done(except in some mods) for increased performance. Full 3d wheels is relatively new like in rF2.

Regards.

 

one supercostly way to do this would be to render say 10 wheels, and offset them in time, and render them with transparency, ... but if one wheel has 2,000 you will be rendering 20,000 triangles just on one wheel, so you can see that this is really not the way ( of course you could render only the spokes .. but still)

 

If you just leave it at one wheel model, you get weird optical illusions like explains.

Some AC cars are tuned to switch more smoothly from the base model to the blurred one than others.

Fullscreen motion blur tends to perform really badly on spinning objects because the gradient in speed isn't changing slowly enough for them to handle. If you have a whole car moving (or the whole track) it's relatively easy to blur those areas, but each bit of the wheel is moving a slightly different direction.

 

Live for speed is one sim that has it and pretty sure I saw it in rfactor 1 also.

That optical illusion is more realistic than seeing the wheel change shape.

I'm no expert on this, it's just something I noticed and thought it would be nice to see it done like I've seen in other sims.
AC is the first time I've noticed wheel rotation done like this.

 

Sorta surprised you haven't noticed it in other sims, it's the standard method as far as I know for at least the last 10+ years. Maybe AC could do more to stop the 'pop' when it switches, there's similar happening with the back end of lots of cars due to LODs.

 

lol, in live for speed is more like "lack of motion blur" rather then feature not to have it,
true, you don't see in on some camera footage (as in posted vid) however with your own eyes, you do see the wheel blurred

 

In real life, in person you may see a blurred wheel, but there's problem with that.

Lack of motion blur is more realistic than motion blur and here's why.

It's impossible to drive a car and see it with your own eyes as it goes around a track, unless it is recorded.

You couldn't possibly see all those different views in person and follow the car around the track in real life like that, especially when you are also driving the car.

So it's obviously meant to be like on tv. Even the replay cameras are labeled TV1, TV2 etc.

So seeing what you see in person is not realistic for replays, as the replays are on tv and wheel rotation should appear as it does on tv as this is a sim.

 

so what's the problem then
?

TV crews used QUALITY cameras, which do produce blur too,
some cheal on-board cameras that people use that don't produce blur doesn't really represent what's out there in majority

or show me some example of major race with does show the effect you speak of

here are some various and all have "blurrerd" wheels





some slower cars here


I'm sorry, I admire your passion for Live For Speed, but live for speed is very old sim, and while it has great physics, the grapics is very poor, therefore the reason why they don't use motion blur on wheels is more like technical limitation, rather then they want to have it real ( where nobody else does that)

you could probably see in on some modded cars in games, when people don't know how to create motion blurred wheel

 

I didn't realise that there are cameras that cause motion blur so you don't see that optical illusion. I don't want it this way just because that's the way it's done in LFS, I actually prefer to see it, than the blur effect. It's just something I remember seeing on videos and I prefer to see that than the way it's done in AC. I could argue that the kind of thing I do on AC would be recorded on a cheap camera and not a tv crew, but that's not really going to hold any water lol.

It must have been mods where I've seen it in other games, if you say that it's not normally done this way, you seem to know quite a bit about this kind of thing.

Maybe if they can make that blur effect not look like the car has different wheels it would be great. But I doubt that will happen as it doesn't seem to bother anyone else but me. If that doesn't happen then I hope when AC becomes open for mods, I'll be able to change the cars wheels to my liking. Though I'll probably need someone to tell me how to do it. Do you think it's possible?

 

Doh!!

 

well, the most simple thing would be not to swap to motion blurred wheel, and if such wheel isn't created it won't , but I don't think you will be able to do it for cars done by Kunos

I agree that the transition could be better, so we shall see if kunos will decide to improve it or not.
it's not only about how it looks, but the blurred wheel also has less detail/triangles so it's also a bit to save FPS

 

Of course, ideally, we could have 1000Hz monitors and not have to do motion blur in software anymore - just use the realistic inability of our eyes to keep up with the framerate. Maybe in 2034.