Is smooth fast ? - Pro drivers give there opinion

IMHO, the smooth doesn't mean the smoothness of steering wheel movement but the smoothness of the vehicle itself on the limit.

In some cars, steering wheel rotation could be smooth on the limit. But in the othet cases, there could be some abrubt wheel movement to make the vehicle smooth on the limt and within the width of the road/track.

It seems a little abstractive but is what I believe and try to be.

 

How steering wheel movement and movement of vehicle can be separated ? If you need to apply some abrupt steering inputs, you have most likely applied too much throttle input, which is not smooth.

IMO Smooth is everything perfect, smooth is boring. Better go slightly over the limit, don't be a computer.

 

I am generally a smooth driver, and I try to drive the Audi A1S1 Quattro in exactly the same way. I absolutely hate "throwing" cars into corners, and this one is no exception. Whilst I am not the fastest driver on the block, I seem to be reasonably quick in this car (if being able to keep pace with Oscar Sahlin, Airlink and Mogo over the weekend is anything to go by). Early days yet, but I still think that "smooth" should be the way to "fast". Personally, I feel that if someone can be really fast in a simulation by throwing cars all over the place, then there is something wrong with the game engine.

 

The biggest issue is that in sim racing everyone thinks they're a Pro driver!

When it comes to sims there is no such thing IMO. Everyone can learn from everyone. We all fit somewhere on the spectrum!

One thing I would say though is not to watch another driver online to fine tune as you never get the detailed fine movements, etc and timing as to what inputs that driver is actually making. Definitely don't take their exact braking points, as latency means it appears they are braking later than what they are.

 

Something that i've definatelly noticed watching the best hotlaps, and this is not specific to AC but to other sims as well, those lap times always look too unrealistic to me, i never seen a real footage of a fast lap that looks like fast laps of an alien driver in a sim.. Very wierd wheel movements and braking points, i was chasing some hotlap with Praga and got reminded that with my driving style (which imo looks very realistic) i can never be first on a popular combo.
Anyone else noticed that and what is your opinion on it, are alien drivers using techniques that would not work in real life?

 

RIP my black stripe :'(

 

Normally you're right. But once we see old Stephan Rosa's RUF driving on Nurnberg Nord, we know why his driving seems a little tough or aggressive rather than smooth. This car may like to turn although with smooth(not low) input. Also in the case, smooth steering movement won't turn off the yawing momentum which makes the car turn quickly.

I don't mean driving style should be like this but it could be different depending on the car. And the smooth that I mentioned includes some slip angle status of course.

The reason why I write this is I saw many people who finds smooth driving only from smooth steering wheel movement.

 

In a simulator drivers can capitlise on track limits much more and can fall back on the car being much more replicable than the real world counterpart, Sim racers also don't have to worry about writing the car of a cupple of times an hour pushing things in ways real drivers would not risk and then sim racers also dont have to wory about limited practice time or tire ware and everything else associated with real world driving.

In real life you have much more noise from the road, G forces and the fact that the real world is much more complex and dynamic than any simulator which makes it much harder to drive a almost robotic lap as you can in a simulator.

So top level sim laps are more the art of mastering a very specific methodology and line and then perfecting that one specific thing.

Real world hot maps are more about adapting the to the changes of the day, adjusting for the tiny micro changes mid lap and then still leaving a small margin of error so that the car is not written off for the race.

Another thing you can often see with simulators are hot laps with funky setups that would be far to dangerous, exspensive to run on a real car ( due to ware / risk of crashing ) or would simply not work.

In addition to that with simulators you often see hot laps where people lean on the tires the engine or gear box in a way real world drivers probably would not.

Still takes a tun of skill to do top level hot laps in a sim and I think most people with the skill set to do fast laps in simulators would also likely do quite well in the real world.

 

I've seen smoother then this. Not sure if I've seen better:

 

In very slow corners I think you can get away with a bit of rally driving, you're not messing up your aero performance by sliding for starters. In medium/fast corners you'd lose too much time.

 

Senna was smooth. But the first on board cameras shaking a lot and the people thing the pilots are agressive.

 

Years back I saw some clip where Jackie Stewart was teaching how to drive on track, and also that top gear clip with James May, I really took in what he said and started to be much faster in sims after that (still not fast though). I used to rage around the track and destroyed my tyres really fast.

 

I saw that exact same clip several times on Dave. One quote that stuck with me is "never get onto the throttle until you know you don't have to get off again" or words to that effect. Amazing advice imo, if you have to release the throttle even slightly after you have started accelerating then you're guaranteed to be losing time and not driving smoothly.

 

The problem is the car acelerate before the turn out, make incorrect line of race. This is not direct related with smoothness or agressive style.

 

I usually compare my run to other driver & smoothness is clearly not something to take in consideration.

Some car require a more aggressive input, while other don't.

There's no such thing as racing style in my opinion. I highly believe it's a funny meme pro race driver try to make people think it exist as an excuse because the car fault. The "oversteer vs understeer" with 4 parts is probably the one that most should watch & forget the rest.

 

I think it is. Accelerating too much and then lifting off and then getting back on the power again is not smoothly exiting a corner.

 

I am still very much a novice sim racer / driver, but I have learned SO MUCH about car control since I have been driving the Lotus 25, Lotus 49 and Maserati 250F, especially the latter. The sensation of drifting around every corner in the 250F.... And the L25 has really taught me about applying smooth, steady throttle but only when the time is right.

I love AC!

 

Actually it's pretty easy.

"Driving smooth" is mainly about driving without abrupt changes in all of the controls. Ok, maybe brake excluded, but even there it plays a role.
The main influence is the throttle. A smooth driving style will try to avoid on-off-on-off phases in-corners and instead have a monotone increasing throttle curve as well as a monotone centering steering wheel.

If a smooth style is faster or not entirely depends on the car, it's setup and especially the tyres.
From my experience, "smooth" is usually faster with slick tyres.

For cars like the Escort, a smooth driving style won't really help, it likes to be thrown around.

 

Such a complicated subject with so much subtle nuance. For me, the biggest weaknesses I see in other drivers are:

1. Not using the whole track. So many people setup for corner entry several feet from the edge of the track, a few feet from the apex and exit it with several feet left to spare. While on some corners on some tracks this might be the ideal path, on most corners it is not. Curbs are made out of cement and not grass for a reason.
2. Missing apexes through braking too late and not being smooth on entry which leads to...
3. Not positioning the car for the earliest possible throttle application on exit. There is absolutely no substitute for getting on the throttle as early as possible at corner exit. Nothing else you do will provide the same level of reward in lowering lap times as mastering this one aspect of racing, both in real life and in sims. The more time you spend on throttle, the fast you will be. Every single corner you take you should evaluate as you go and try to push and push for earlier throttle application until it gets you into trouble and you know you've reached a limit. At that point, you then take it to the next level and try to nurture the ability to reorient the car mid-corner to allow even earlier throttle application.

Smooth affects each of these things but does not exist in a vacuum. Another word for smooth, if you don't hit your marks and use the whole track and constantly try to get on the throttle earlier and earlier, is slow.

IMO of course.

 

here's a quote from a site I'm finding incredibly useful for understanding car physics and setups. ( http://www.turnfast.com/tech_handling/handling )