Assetto Corsa Competizione - 2020 Generic discussion

Have you considered presenting the SA in a different way e.g. a Licence rating or banding, any thoughts on the Pros and Cons? Also, another idea would be to let drivers in to a server (or at least those e.g. 50+) that are say within 10% of the requirement to help it fill up a bit, rather than have a single point hard cut-off, perhaps as a server option. I do favour the idea of using Licences and Driving Categories to restricts things rather than terms such as SA and RC as it just anchors things in the real word a bit more.

 

But unlike life....we all started equal in ACC with 0 SA

 

It's really interesting to see the focus of the people here.
SA, SA, SA.
It doesn' t matter that the results table of a race is wrong as soon as a driver leaves the server and that the results table disappears after session restart.
It's only important to have a at least 70+ SA to be able to join almost each server to do a race that doesn't give you neither correct nor lasting results.

Maybe SA is so important for the guys here because nothing else is to achieve in ACC? I don't know.

 

Is there some kind of hidden message ?

 

Clean, safe racing is very important in the overall experience, hence the importance people put on it. It’s also not a straightforward, black or white topic. The issues you quote are an annoyance but in reality a bug should be raised to track those, I don’t think there is much to discuss around whether people want to see the correct/persistent results or not.

 

People be all SA hurt.

 

A very good point.
However, it has been made more difficult now for newer players due to the way that SA is awarded since it was changed (was it in March/April time?).
Also since then it was released officially (in may) and there are more players on now, and therefor more with less respect and experience.
When it first started it was EA, so more would have been genuine enthusiasts and possibly more respectful.
Just a thought.

 

Yes, I'm been an ir member for almost 6 year, so i know the safety ranking and how the MR was more deep/logic/right/interesting.

And here come my disappointment.
I mean, i try to explain in a better way:

The way you collect "good points" in MR and ACC is simply good. I'd say even perfect, watching the system from the outside.

What is too simple, or even bad in our safety system is the way a player collect ”BAD points". Right now we have only car-to-car contacts and no other.
We can do cuts (real cuts, not 2 wheel out of the line), 360°, go straight to the wall, overtake with yellow flags and nothing happens to SA.

This is why, honestly, my expectations in the ACC's SA rating was higher.
I understand your limitations in MR due to a modding work (and still and excellent work), but now the SA system is completely integrated into the game by the devs, and in the end the final results seems about the same, again, watching it from outside.

I mean, to me the system is super deep/complicated/sophisticated when it collect good points, but waaaay to simple in the way it collects bad points.

Let's say in the extreme example:
1- Now i can do slides, donuts and crash again the wall for an entire race, but without losing any SA just cause noone is near to me so for the system i am a safe driver,or better, i've been safe for that race.

2- In the other hand, i can have 1 hour clean race without mistakes and risks running alone and then have a good and fair dogfight with some contact or bumper to bumper situation with another guy (doesn't matters who is fault). I agree if i lose some SA, but in the end for the system i am not a safe driver like the other one in the 1st example, and this is bad, and is what happens in free server online.


Our SA system needs to watch ALSO what player is doing by himself and not only what is doing when is near to other players.

Imho.

 

If someone is spinning or crashing into a wall all on their own, the SA system doesn't consider them a "safe driver".
It doesn't consider them at all. I think there is a huge distinction between the two.

For cutting you'll eventually get drive through penalties, how is that relevant to safety?
I agree on the overtaking on yellow flags situation though, but that is probably a way harder nut to crack than it appears from the outside.

 

I have been saying this since the beginning and finally someone agrees with me.
Running clean lap after clean lap in a race should go somewhere towards your SA, whether near someone or not (providing you are clean of course).
There is no incentive to hotlap in a race at the moment and people are leaving if, say, they are at the back or the pack.
This should only be in multiplayer to keep people online.

 

That’s the issue, it doesn’t consider them at all. if you crash into a wall or spin out when alone or severely cutting corners then they are unsafe and their sa should reflect that.

Perhaps SA is too focused in punishing both poor and good drivers due to not being able to distinguish the 2 (which is obviously not easy to do). However if one of those drivers continues to be dangerous lap after lap and the other doesn’t (both without making any contact) then that would distinguish them both and their as should be adjusted accordingly.

 

I think there is a mis-understanding about what SA is about. It's about situation awarness and how you manage to be safe when racing in close range.

If you run alone good and regular time your RC, CC, CN will rise so your global rating.

Peoples focuses only on SA that the mistake.
Maybe asking for a minimum global rating to enter a server is a way.

Or maybe as Minolin says problem is the scale if SA that is off.

 

Just giving out "free" trust for driving alone on track is just asking for people to exploit it and farm SA. And subsequently complain in this forum that their hard-earned rating gets decimated whenever they come close to other drivers because all that driving did not translate into increasing their skill.

However, if I remember correctly, Minolin said somewhere that he's looking into giving people a little trust boost for finishing races, so that people who usually end up driving alone (whether in the front, in the back or somewhere in a bubble in the middle of the field) don't go out empty-handed.

That might be what you're looking for, but I wouldn't expect the payout to be as high as when you're racing cleanly in close proximity to other cars.

SA is focused on collisions, yes. And it "punishes" both drivers because usually (in the long run) both parties share responsability for the collision. It's not always 50/50 (most often it is not), but a safe driver knows how to "read" his opponents and how to avoid being caught in their mistakes. Not always, but it makes a huge difference.

 

I agree with your post. I have no issue with SA, but I tend to float around 70 which is fortunate as it gives me access to good lobbies when I want them. It seems there is an unhealthy obsession with SA because it is effectively THE gatekeeper behind which the *assumed* nirvana of racing lies (despite other ratings thresholds having to be reached to unlock SA).
As an experiment, if lobbies were restricted behind TO rating I'd be interested in what would happen... The fall of civilised racing as we know it, or just the fall of SA related threads?

 

Imho SA should also consider behaviour when you are alone on the track.
So if you leave track and crash spend some OBWP and if you drive a clean lap spend a little bit trust, so people see a green SA number after crossing the finish line after a lonely but clean lap. This could keep players in a race, now they quit after a small accident. People say for that other numbers are there. CC, CN etc. But I think nobody cares about these numbers. Only SA is important.
I said it from the beginning: Safety and performance rating would be enough.

So I like SA system as it is right now, but I would like it even more if it would spend some trust for a lonely clean lap. This could prevent players from quitting server after a crash.

 

Me too

 

People think a high SA ranked server is the holy grail.
But I had some clean races with zero incs and a lots of close dogfights on only SA19 server and wreckfests on SA70 servers.

I don't care about SA and drive on all servers, but of course when I am on an unrated server I expect inexperienced noobs and stay away from them. Before I start a dogfight, I first observe the race and the drivers' behaviour on this server.
Sometimes you get surprised how civilized drivers behave even on a low SA server. Then you can trust in a fight in a pack of 5, because everybody is holding his line and not doing crazy stupid things.

I recall a race where we were in a pack of 6, wheel on wheel, side by side running towards T1 at Monza and everybody survived T1. This normaly impossible thing only happened because of SA and civilized drivers. If I recall correct it only was on a server with mid SA restriction.

 

It is possible, for example, to turn off the text overlays when adjusting the brake bias ore engine map?

 

The thing is, its SA that determines how many servers are at your disposal, that's why its important.
I may not be the fastest driver, in fact due to having a full motion rig I usually lose several places at the green light (for reasons I have already explained), but I am still respectful and safe.

I agree, maybe a global rating would work, but the servers are not exactly full now, so would this make it even less so.

You don't need this to farm for SA, there are plenty of ways for those who want to do it. They could play SP with low settings, they could play MP with mates and just spend the session playing overtaking each other.
People who want to farm will do.
But not all of us want to. I want to race with like minded people (NOT single player). I want an incentive to stay when I am hotlapping last, middle or even first (apart from winning).
SA = Safety Rating, i.e how SAFE you are on the track. You can be safe/dangerous when alone. I don't see it as Trust (should that be a different entity all together, TR?).
Perhaps Trust would fit more in with RaceCraft? You can show you can race cleanly.

I certainly don't want SA to grow when hotlapping the same as it would when driving bumper to bumper, door to door, but it should still have some bearing if you are being 'safe'.

As @GRFOCO said, I could drive 10-15 laps alone in a race, every lap within a 1/2 second of each other, without a single incident, then on the last lap another driver could drive into me on purpose and I would lose SA.

Perhaps I am alone in this and the one in the wrong. ​