What's the benefit of turning off stability control?

i guess the problem is where is the line between an "artificial" aid and car's charateristics (as for active aerodynamics or suspensions).. f1 car had a totally different weight distribution when they had tc, so on those car tc was an aid or a car's characteristics, as an e-diff?

 

I was pretty disappoint when I found that I had forgotten to turn off 35% SC...I thought I'd actually gotten better at tossing / catching the car. :/ Welp guess i better drive some more

 

One of my favorite things about AC is even at this early stage it seems to be attracting new drivers that aren't afraid to question age old sim racing practices. For me, the future looks bright. Having said that, I drive in pro mode with AC because I've found my lead foot out of corners is getting me in to trouble more often than not. With SC on, its just more forgiving and catchable when you begin to loose traction. A great quality of AC is the game gives you such a feeling of connection to what's happening in terms of grip. Where I'm at in the learning curve, I want this sensation heightened, not diminished. These days I find I'm more careful with my throttle control and I'm beginning to realize the car is so much easier to control when its on a good line.

 

Same here. I'm totally new to sim racing (though not driving/racing games) and I just thought to myself, if I'm starting with zero knowledge and experience, why make it harder on myself by learning once with assists on, and then have to relearn with assists off.

Once I accepted that I was going to be well off the pace of the 'pro' racers I found I relaxed more and started to enjoy the whole learning experience.

The frustrating time will come when I realise that I've become as quick as I'm ever going to be, and I'm still a lot slower than the fastest drivers

 

I've driven driven racing sims for 10 years now since the release of Richard Burns Rally. I've been there too and still there are those aliens that makes me feel like I'm a beginner. There is no easy way but you are on the right track. People tend to think that there is some magic setup why faster guys are faster. No. Setup isn't everything. Ofcourse you can find some pace with setup but mostly when you feel confident to push that's enough. And remember usually fastest lap times are not those that looks quickest. Try with different driving lines, gears and braking styles. With performance app you can see easily which one is the quickest way. For example everybody knows how to push brakes but the way you release the pedal is much more important. Brakes aren't only for slowing the car down.

And back to the topic. I don't use any assists. I get much more satisfaction when I have a control over the electronics. And satisfaction is the reason why I'm still there after ten years.

 

I hope for you that your frustration will go away quickly, like it did for me. It is a normal phase, but not the best time in SIM racing.
I am slow but I still like SIM for the competition aspect, I just have to be competing with people punching at the same weight.
I am not going to be world champion, but I still can have a lot of fun.
Once we have MP, we will be able to organize races with people with similar pace, we might also be able to mix different talent using car with different performance that will allow the slowest to mix it up with the faster crowd. Just like we do with AI, but better. AC, with the intuitive way we can drive in it promise to have the best MP that we could ever dream of. Looking forward to race everyone soon.

 

Would you like an aid that turns automaticly your steering wheel?

real hardcore drivers we dont even like an engine blipping or cutting automaticlly, we don't like help

and if the car is too hard to drive for me, means i'm not good to drive that car, like in real life would happen to majority of us trying to be a f1 drivers or rally driver

 

I've found I am pretty good with the E30 now (checking live timing) but my position is much worse with the Formula Abarth which I find a much easier car to quick lap so I understand and agree with Albert's point.

As to the MP component... Well, There is only one champion in any racing championship whether it is F1, WRC or the slow but fun VLN racing. Someone has to be second (that ALMOST) and someone has to be last with others filling the positions in between. Doesn't mean there is no fun to be had if you are not in the top 10 at the end of the day. I'd rather be dead last in a race (or championship for that matter) but finish knowing I never did something bad to block faster drivers or cause them to slow down because of my mistakes, as well as make sure I finish the race myself with a complete car not something that spent 5 minutes in pitstops undergoing virtual repair. Would probably mean I also learnt something new so that is not wasted time in my books.

 

Did they forget to mention modern jets are capable of doing Mach+...

Without an ejector seat/parachute, it'd be near certain death 100% of the time a modern jet would crash.
I doubt the same could be said of motorsport, considering the speed that they carry and the amount of races that's going on in a daily basis around the globe.

When MP arrives it'll still be the same as it's always been, you'll find the vast majority of servers won't allow any aids at all.
This is what seperates the casual/noobs(aids) from the hardcore/sim racers.

Not using aids has got nothing to do with being elitist or snobbish, it's about challenging yourself in a way only a sim racer can know and understand.
That mafrien'... cannot be taught, it can only be felt.

Why do some people go through a FPS at the hardest possible settings, turning every in-game assist off.??
Like i said, nothing to do with being elitist or snobbish mafrien'.

 

I disable every aid except ABS because I feel the car is closer to real. I don't think AC can accurately simluate electronics. If someone assured me that using SC wont make the car more arcadish, and farther from the real counterpart, I'd gladly use it.

 

I always drive with everything turned off, just for more seat-of-the-pants feel and satisfaction I(myself) mastered te car(somewhat)

GPL was a real eyeopener with everything turned off, LFS & RBR too. GPL & LFS made me a better(trackday) driver and drifter too imo.

Anyway, I'm Always is PRO mode(never custom), this means in -for example- with the 599XX @ Monza EVERYTHING is turned off I guess(including ABS?) I just got 'silver' at that event. Braking distances are short with that thing
Though I read race-ABS is standard on a 599XX and TC is adjustable(just like in many other racecars atm)

Cheers
Robin

 

Which will be a mistake.

This is what scares people off who are new to online sim racing and I think they should be catered for too. Yes they can practice offline and against AI but anyone who's been sim racing for any length of time knows it's just not the same as racing online against real people. When they make a simple mistake they get lambasted by the so called 'pro's' and are made to feel as welcome as a fart in a space suit, so they assume they're not good enough and some don't return to it.

AC is a new game in a very niche market. We really should be encouraging new comers so as to help the genre grow. Instead of forcing everyone to drive with all aids off, we should be helping those who are new to the genre by allowing them to use aids and drive alongside others at the same stage of their online career as them. We were all noobs at one time and we all strive to be better.

I have read posts of guys who are "terrified" at the idea of racing online because they don't want to upset 'better/faster' drivers. In reality these guys have the correct mindset for racing, they have respect for others which is the main ingredient for a good (sim) racer. They shouldn't be scared away by the elitists, some of whom have no respect for others and barge their way to the front of the pack to declare themselves '...better than you'!

Sorry, rant over.

PS I'm not having a dig at you paulie, I'm just making a point, mafrien'

 

Very well said, and really understanding of you

Basically, we could do with a hierarchy of servers, from noobs with driving aids, to pros with no aids. You should be able to progress through the ranks, I guess - a bit like an offline career mode, but for real.

That way, noobs get racing experience in a sympathetic environment, and pros get to race without their experience ruined by beginners bashing them off

 

Pretty sure even a total newb will be able to figure out how to set up a server with aids and such set how they want them. If there is a decent server browser I'm sure that "Newb Friendly" will be plenty popular.

 

I host F1 2013 servers with mates and it caters for all levels, allowing you to choose which 'aids' to use.

What we do is then allow for ability differences as we know each other, calling out that we are 'xxx passing left side', the slower driver then moves to the right to allow this.
We know aids slow the car down but some just don't have the perception/ability/skill or co-ordination to drive without them (one mate only has one leg so braking is hard,
some have inferior hardware etc) so we adapt to them thus letting them drive against humans

 

aids = safe is good for those that need it
the problem is when the aids are over powered leading to guys trying hard driving the car themselves then someone with the computer mostly driving their car blows them away
give em safety and playability but give them a performance penalty too

then they even have an incentive to improve
engineers wanna engineer and make all those funky performance systems
but drivers should want to drive, meaning control the car yourself
or download a replay of some aliens and get a fisher price wheel and pretend you are a great driver

there can be some problems with cars engineered with say abs going to be on so without they drive terribly

hopefully multiplayer will show beside name what aids etc

 

Funny how some real life motorsports competition permit the use of so called casual/noob aids. First reply is ofc that it is not permitted in F1 and I would like to point out that F1 or Nascar aren't the only examples of motorsports just like football/soccer is not the only sport with a ball (despite what sports news on TV would have me believe).

Don't get me wrong, like I've said after my initial post in this thread, I did find that SC slowed me down a lot. In fact I haven't used SC either only after reading this topic to make an outright comparison and found it to be slowing me down. But I don't see the point of enforcing a NO AIDS rule on a server running an E92 race when the car has a metric ton of electronics out of the crate to help the driver go faster. Not keep them understeering, not keep them safe from barriers, but actually be faster than the one not using those aids.

@ paulie I understand plenty people out there are out for the greatest challenge they can find in any activity they partake in, be that a triathlon, a game of ARMA, a car simulator or perhaps even building a V12 motor the size of a matchbox for the sake of doing it. What I don't understand is why if I only run super triatlons everyone else should do the same otherwise they are a wuss and nothing else. Surely that would be elitism wouldn't it? Considering there is competition running 6/21/40 km where the level of competition is just as good.

Keep in mind I am talking about cars that have the aids as standard. If you race those cars and chose to circumvent their electronics because you are John Wayne and James Dean's love child that is completely fine with me, but try to think outside your box for a second. Not everyone wants to play race sims to tame the bull, but to have good competition with real people instead of AI. Only playing by the rules of the select few because they like living in their shiny makebelieve castles is what I call playing with the snob elite. I will adhere to their rules eventually because I really like the game but I might never give it 100% because it is under forced circumstances. It's just another point of view to consider, nothing more.

Edit: reference for smalles V12 in the world: http://www.gizmag.com/spanish-engineer-crafts-the-worlds-smallest-v-12-engine/20636/ for those that might not have seen the awesome skills of this man!

 

Hey np's mafrien'.

And the point you made is a goodn'.
I'm just afraid the servers that don't allow the use of aids will be the vast majority and this could make some folks feel alienated.

@ mistery...
You asked people to explain their view on this because you don't get it, and that is what i tried to do.
But...

I used the "casual/noob aids" as an example of gamers who may only pick up the sim for 30-60mins at a time, if that, and then stick something else on cause they get bored.
This was not a dig at the casual gamer, i was explaining that they may have other preferences to race sims and use it(racesim) as a secondary or 3rd choice.
It takes practise and commitment to race any sim at the hardest level, and this is what all of us(not literal) try to do.

You were the one that said people and no use of aids... snobland and elitist.
I already said in my previous post it's got nothing to do with that.

anyways... this is what dedi servers are for...
If you've got the bandwidth then you can set the server rules yourself and have it to your liking.

But if your serious, the day will come mafrien' when you'll want to turn everything off while racing OL or offline.
That's the day that all race sims become a completely different experience, you get what others have been talking about and can never go back.

 

Coming from Forza I've forced myself to turn off the assists and just eat dirt until I get it right. Only reason is because after all those years on Forza which isn't even a sim, I found myself too reliant on certain driving assists. ABS, Traction, and the worst, Driving line. I found relying on assists keeps you from really learning the track and how the car behaves. Just a personal preference, also that much more satisfying when you finally start to climb that steep learning curve and put clean laps down. Feels goooood man.