Wr with gamepad? how fast should gamepad vs wheel be in ac?

I've seen now quite a few silly posts mentioning this. How can you even say something so stupid like this?

A wheel is a wheel no matter how cheap or expensive it is, it simulates driving a car (as best as it can). I've said multiple times and repeated multiple times, but it seems that ignorant people the more you try to make it obvious the more they ignore you: I accept and admit that I'm not the fastest wheel user and I don't mind other wheel users (see that?) being faster than me, that is not an issue I have and not the issue this topic is about, no matter how much you and other ignorant people want to make out of it...

I've also seen you're post that you are repeating now. I'm not sure what you want me to reply to this...

Yeah, sure their skill is to be saluted, but I don't salute the fact that the game lets them be that fast. You can be the fastest alien pad user in the world if a game only lets you go 50km/h you won't go 51km/h not even if you stand on your head while playing.

I'm not against their skill, I against the fact that they're allowed by the game to be as fast as wheels.

Anyway, can we please stop now? I won't convince you, you won't convince me and this will go on forever. Stop giving me excuses to reply, I really don't want to reply anymore because it's getting redundant, but I keep getting quoted or provoked... let's just agree to disagree and let this topic die please. Like I've admitted, I'm the minority here, so nothing is gonna change in AC regarding this.

 

SIM RACING is just that, a WHEEL / PEDALS , setting up degrees of steering, braking parameters, adjusting spring pressures in your kit................GAMEPADS are for freakin' arcade / simcades , and IF AC has gone that route ( making it easier for pads/ keyboard) just to sell more and make some cash, THEN DON'T LET ME HEAR THAT PCARS ETC is a simcade anymore, because AC will have lost any cred it once had.

 

It's the same physics, people are just taking advantage of the pad. For example no FFB means it's less demanding on the body, you can get more consistency if you have a lot of practise. The analogue sticks let you steer faster, 180* lock can be put on in under a second. It's just making the car do impossible things in real life, but if we connected some sort of electronically controlled and assisted steering on a real car it would perform as it does in AC, that is if the physics are somewhat realistic in game.

I don't see a problem at all.

 

How fast should pad users be then ? Because we have wheel users 30 seconds off pace on the Nords, alien pad users shouldn't be allowed to be able to go faster than them ? Please.... Let's not exaggerate here.

 

Now why did you have to say that? Bleh...

I just can't stay aside and not respond to silly things like that: because that sort of electronically controlled and assisted steering does not exist in real cars in the 1st place? Is that a good reason enough to be a problem?

If we would take everything only based on possibility and not facts, then why not add planes in game and race against them? Or how about command spawning of black holes to get from stat to finish in less than 1 second? That would be even quicker and in the realm of theoretical possibility...

If it's not like that in reality it should not be the sim either, but for the sake of gaming let's agree we allow them (pads, M&K) to be in the sim too, ok? Good, then make them have a penalty enough so that they don't interfere with the actual simulation and be as fast as the gear that simulates reality.

They want to play with pad? Fine, they will be slow. They want to be fast? They should buy a wheel. As simple as that. This is (should be) a sim, not a sim-cade or and arcade game.

I bet that if AC would have had these simulation rules from the beginning no one would have questioned "why are pads and K&M so slow compared to wheels", because it would have been understood from the start that this sim takes is simulation seriously and unless you use the gear that actually simulates what cars use in reality, then you will be penalized in terms of performance.

That didn't happen and now people feel entitled to be as fast with pads as wheels, like it's something normal in a sim. Well it's not, a true sim would not compromise it's simulation like this, a sim-cade one will do that. That's what GT and Forza are for, AC should be about wheels.

I really need to "unwatch" this topic. I'm gonna do it now.

 

Easier in the way that they gave good support to set the steering speed and sensitivity etc.. like most sim racing games. In fact, those arcade racing games aren't especially easy to drive the car. AC is neither easy to drive with gamepad, at least competitively. Even is hard to drive competitive with a wheel. So yea, Kunos didn't give easy support for gamepad like giving them a boost/special assists, but good support for people to enjoy the cars, the tracks, the driving in general.

 

You are still continuing to base your arguments on flawed logic that consumer wheels can simulate real car wheels. They aren't TRUE SIMULATION (two words which you mentioned quite a lot) as they can't simulate what real steering wheel on the real car does (hardware limitations). Even FFB in AC isn't that realistic as it provides too much data (or boosted), there goes your TRUE SIMULATION... (maybe penalize FFB wheel users for this?)

If you really want AC to have rules/standardization regarding simulation hardware for inputs, then Kunos in fact should also penalize unrealistic wheel users and force everyone to use same kind/performance hardware to not get penalty and this should apply to other hardware such as pedals or other peripherals. This standardization would be silly for the obvious reasons for such product as AC.
The fact that you want to penalize gamepad users, but missing that using 360 wheel lock on 1000+ car isn't a realistic input tool makes you a hypocrite and unfit for objective discussion.

Using a controller that has round shape (so called wheel) which has totally different performance compared to a real wheel on the real car doesn't make it more realistic than the gamepad except for the sake of having round shape.
If you don't understand this then you are the ignorant one.

Even Kunos doesn't agree with you as most users here. I think you should stop persuading everyone with your opinion because the further you go the more silly your arguments look and the thread is already silly.

 

This thread is inane enough that it will probably warrant an article at pretendracecars.com

 

Very simply, if you are buying better equipment to go faster you are wasting your money, some basic racing knowledge and practice, practice and some more practice will get you the times, not the kit you own.

If a guy with a pad practices he will get faster, same for a guy with a wheel.

The main point is I personally do not and will never buy equipment thinking it will make me faster, I have bought all the pieces to my rig for the immersion factor, id rather be entertained and middle of the pack than quick and bored.

So if you have a wheel and its giving you a good Sim experience who cares what the rest are doing.

 

This is one of the silliest things I've read in a while.

If it really, really, REALLY bothers you that people are faster than you surely it'd be sensible to suggest separate leaderboards, at a push?

Just out of interest do you use a modified motion controller to simulate tools for when you're working on your car setup?...and allot a realistic amounts of time for each job.

Any argument that this is a simulator, therefore everything must be as realistic as possible, seems to overlook the fact the game includes tracks from Britain.....yet no bloody rain! Defence rests it's case.

 

Yes, please take your wheel supremacy ideas elsewhere, it's not wanted here!

But also.....
(though I doubt you'll see the connection)

 

The heck with unwatching the topic and asking not to be quoted again, it seems that you want me to reply and if I'm provoked I will do exactly that.

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That's really funny, or not, because setting up the car in AC with a real pit crew in your room, with a motion controller in some virtual garage (that AC does not even have) or doing it in a menu as we do it now, considering you set up the same values to the car in all cases, none of those influence how you actually drive the car in AC.
Because this is what this topic is all about: the way you drive it, with a wheel, pedals, shifters, etc... or with a pad/M&K. That's the part that matters and where the simulation fails, because you can drive as fast as with a wheel with pad and M&K and that should not be the case.

Let me put it this way: If I were to decide how AC should treat all the input devices I would make the ones that simulate the real devices in a real car be the ones that have the highest performance. Pads and M&K would only be user-friendly so they can be used too, but not even close to as fast as the devices that simulate the real parts of the car.

This would be put as a disclaimer and a warning when you buy AC and when you start AC, so everyone who buys it knows what's all about and it would show that the game is committed and serious about every detail of simulation and make as little as possible compromises for that.

Fortunately for you (all of you) I don't decide that, so you have nothing to worry about then do you?

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@everyone:
Do I have to say it again? I won't change my mind about this, so stop trying to do that. Every time you provoke me with a reply trying to convince me that I'm wrong, I'm obliged to defend my belief again. You think I'm wrong, I think I'm not and this will go on forever. You can't change my view on this anymore than I can change yours...

 

tl:dr
"someone is faster than me with a more difficult/cheaper input device. artificially make them slower than me so i can feel better about myself" -PAFKA

 

Funny how you only see what you want to see and ignore that fact that those guys with their pads and K&M are faster not only than me, but faster than hundreds of other wheel users...

Take a look on RSR leaderboards, or you want me to post screenshots now?

I get it, I'm the only one that cares about this... the other hundreds of people don't care because in their heads it makes sense for pad and K&M to be that fast in a racing game that calls itself "simulator".

 

Faster than hundreds of wheel users that are slow

FTFY

 

Right.. and how slow is slow exactly? More precise how slow is slow on Nordschleife? Because slow on Nords is not the same as on other tracks.

I know you won't agree, but for me slow is +1 min from WR, +50-40 even 30 seconds from WR is slow, but the more we come closer to WR the more that slow is not so slow anymore. How is 1 min slow compared to 30 seconds slow?

And how about this? Is 10 seconds slower than WR slow for you? For me it's not, it's certainly fast, not alien fast, but faster than 98-99% of the people driving in AC on Nords, so not slow at all actually.

So that guy with the pad did a +10 second WR lap time and all the others with +10.xxx/+11 seconds times are slow now? Please....

Again, I don't expect you to agree just for sake of not agreeing with me...

 

I'm glad that the gamepad is a usable device on this game as it opens up the target audience to casual simmers and people who just want the experience.

More people to race against and more revenue for the devs. better that than empty servers with wheel users wishing...

 

You are wrong here.
Good gamepad support is one of the selling points for AC. It is better than in other sims.
Kunos made compromises on AC simuliation compared to netkar pro and started working on features that will attract more general public to get more sales so that the project can stay alive. Market didn't need just another one rFactor which is lagging behind regarding simuliation features, Kunos couldn't fit there, therefore different way was chosen.
True hardcore simmers don't care about people using gamepads as they don't care that someone is only driving with optimum setups and soft slicks (this part of community is very important to have). While ability to make more sales is advantage for everyone as it means more development in the project. Some general gamers might not be happy that a few gamepad users are better than them on leaderboards, if that's the case maybe AC is not the sim title for them...
Afterall RSR leaderboards aren't AC product, so maybe you should chase them regarding result filtering.

This is anecdotal evidence. You selected some samples that works for your theory. If you really want to prove anything here you will have to provide objective statistics otherwise you will be regarded as wrong in this topic regardless of what phyloshopies you are pushing here.
You have a fair point about wheel but you are putting useless evidence and very silly arguments as facts to prove your point.
Please just stop with your theories about round shape controller master race theory and gives up some proof. Then we can talk.

P.s. you don't need to reply to every reply providing the same theory based on useless evidence.

 

Sounds like your just jealous to me. Who cares if someone else is faster with a pad, just go and play the game and enjoy.