Tyre grip feedback via FFB - make it more informative

I have over 2,200 hours in AC, and it's the only sim I play. But you know what? I can't shake the feeling that it's so slippery.

Trust me, I've heard all the arguments like:

• "you're going much faster than you think you are"
• "you don't have the seat of your pants G force feel"
• "you're not scared about hitting the fence"

I know, I know. But I always have the niggling, subconscious feeling in the back of my mind, "Huh, I'm sliding off the track like there's not much friction or grip from these supposedly slick tyres".

I also know that the forces transmitted to the FFB are a "pure" result of the physics calculations (forgetting about canned effects).

I wonder if a little physics fidelity could be sacrificed to allow more "grip" feel to be transmitted through the FFB though, in the interest of compensating for the lack of other physical cues you have in real life like "seat of your pants" feel? I'm thinking something like a lighter wheel when understeering or sliding, perhaps a little more force when the tyre bites again, that kind of thing. It's not "pure physics", but a sim is about tricking your mind into thinking that you're driving a car, not doing calculations in a physics spread sheet.

It's something that I'd love to be able to try. Actually, I think a python app can dynamically adjust the strength of the FFB. You could multiply the dynamic FFB by some kind of slip angle deviation or some such. Hmmmm.....

 

Maybe you have fake effects like the enhanced understeer, if you enable this then it wouldn't be much of a surprise that it will feel like you have less grip then there is. It could be other settings in FFB but I really dont know what you want to amplify in terms of grip feel to me it gives enough info. I dont use that setting and actually never have but could always feel understeer fine without needing it or any of the other fake effects.

If your sliding off the track your using more grip then you have available so no point making it feel like you have even more to just slide further off track.

 

Here's a recent post of mine regarding such considerations - important part in bold. My post has a slightly aggressive note to it and that's not directed at you @WallyM.

Bottom line is that when you bend the sim to something you - personally - deem more realistic (even though it's less realistic by the numbers) then why should others agree with you?

 

I haven't tried it personally, but doesn't the 'SLIP' enhancement do just what you are asking for?

 

I believe slip just vibrates the wheel any time theirs tyre spin/slip.

I think OP is talking about wanting how PC2 does it where Self Aligning Torque / Slip Feel-Side Load can be adjusted like a ratio via Tone in options.



The picture shows how it behaves at 50% Tone, or 1:1 ratio of SAT & Side Load/Slip. Maybe I'm wrong though lol

 

^Yeah, no thanks. Let's leave that stuff for simcades..

There's no replacement for information from accelerations you feel in your body in real life and that's just something a simulation driver needs to work around.

 

Try rf2.

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On the other hand, i read from a real world driver that he believes that the feeling of losing and regaining grip isn't modelled (or modelled well) in the FFB of any sim. So, ya, i guess there's definitely room for improvement on the FFB side, still.

https://pretendracecars.net/2015/05/05/blurring-the-line-with-severin-austerschmidt/

 

LOL

 

Always here for your amusement. Although i never know what you're laughing at really. But, hey, don't have to understand everything. I guess you have some inexplicable and irrational aversion against the site itself. But, not sure.

 

Don't ever quote anything from PRC if you want to be taken serious in a sim discussion. Just don't.

 

It's an interview. And the guy interviewed really exists. I don't see the problem. Actually the interview is very informative, and AC gets a lot of praise.

 

Understeereffects is off. I can't really feel understeer until it's too late often, and that's a common complaint you hear about AC, that it's very understeery. But I'm not talking about just understeer. I'm talking about all loss of traction.

I think I have slip effects on to some degree, but that just vibrates the wheel. I might have to try higher values of that. I also have increased the tyre screech onset volume percentage and increased the overall FFB strength, and that has helped the feeling to some degree.

 

Silly question but could it be that the wheel is exhausted? As in some effects you're not feeling because the wheel itself is worn and just doesn't produce the same FFB it once did. Have you used the same wheel for all 2200 hours?

The internals are they rubber bands that produce the FFB like most wheels? It's very possible that over time the rubber has become stretched to some degree, I don't think you could avoid it.

 

Start by disabling everything but leave the gain at 100% and use min force if your wheel needs it (check with WheelCheck). Then either download the FFBClip app and reduce the in-game "per car" gain until you aren't clipping during normal high speed cornering. Clipping during jolts from kerbs and etc is absolutely fine. And now you are done.

 

Increasing the tyre sound onset % would make things worse. That number relates to how much slip you need for the sound to be heard, raising it means you don't hear tyres until they slip even more.

Slip effects is just a vibration but the enhanced understeer option is not a vibration and would give you exactly what you want : a more brutal ffb drop when understeering.

 

Which is way too much exaggerated and Stefano still refuses to do me the favour to add some control over it after all the support I gave to the game.
And now i forgot to wish him for his birthday. Oh well, now it's never gonna happen...

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Enchanced understeer is so brutal that at higher angles it feels like the FFB is almost off.

 

Try turning minimum force up. I use 6% on my TX with 100% gain (75% TM software) and 12% on my TS-PC with 58% gain (90% TM software). That gives you more centre feel so you can feel & react to oversteer quicker and thus reduce it and balance the car on the limit better.

 

An affordable and properly configured motion rig would solve alot of this problems IMHO