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A couple questions

Discussion in 'Chit Chat Room' started by Parminio, Feb 10, 2017.

  1. Andy-R

    Andy-R Alien

    I know these are harsh words but the guy in the MAN lorry should have his racing licence revoked, he is WAY over the curbs!
     
  2. Berniyh

    Berniyh Alien

    Well, be free to define it the way you like, no issues with that.

    After all, AC lets the server admin decide how many tyres may be off track until the car is considered to be off track and therefore you might receive a penalty. 2 is a common selection, but yes, others might choose differently here.
    The track boundaries are defined by the track maker, so that counts.
    Overall, the system works pretty fine.

    There are mainly two things, which I don't like about ACs penalty system:
    1. The system is more permissive in race mode than in qualification. In principle that's ok, you shouldn't get a penalty every time you're outside of the track. However, the time should be invalidated nevertheless and that is not the case.
    Basically what that boils down to is that on many tracks you can set the fastest lap times during a race because you can take lines that would not be permitted in qualification. That's just wrong.

    2. The system doesn't care in any way about the track situation. Take Monza, 2nd chicane. I've been dive bombed there so many times …
    Anyway, when that happens, in some cases you can't cut in and thus need to take the way straight over the unpermitted area.
    I have even been straight black flagged by the game, just because I avoided a dive bomber. (And yes, I myself would have made that corner just fine.)
    I also got a penalty because someone went right into me there and pushed me off track. Which is wrong as well.
    Or you might get a penalty because you avoided someone even if that did cost you several seconds to just get back to the track.
    I'm really not the kind of person that gets pissed off by crashes, stupid behaviour etc. but this penalty system in such situations made me rage quit quite a few times because it just sucks to get punished if your race was already ruined by someone else.
     
    Hagen likes this.
  3. Parminio

    Parminio Simracer

    Incorrect.

    The while line ON THE RACING SURFACE is the boundary of the track. If all 4 wheels go beyond that line, you're penalized.

    Well, you're supposed to be. But F1 drivers these days cry rivers of tears if you so much as suggest they stay on the damn track.
     
    Horus likes this.
  4. Berniyh

    Berniyh Alien

    What Minolin was talking about is that in some racing series (and no, we're not talking about F1 here), they let you go wherever you want. Can even go 5m off track, they don't care.
    And in some cases, they define the track boundaries a bit less strict as you do, e.g. take into account some curbs etc.
     
    Minolin likes this.
  5. Parminio

    Parminio Simracer

    It's not my definition. It's the FIA's. It applies to all racing sanctioned by the FIA.
     
  6. Minolin

    Minolin Staff Member KS Dev Team

    Made my day :)

    Credits to you then :D But I see this as major part of the problem.

    Imagine we are racing online on a track where the 3- vs. 2-wheel rule make a notable difference (not easy to build this example though). Both of us drive within the rule we think applies.
    You can see me doing +.2s every lap on this corner. To you this is a clear violation, making you call me a cutter. I feel treated unjustly. What an unnecessary source of frustration, but still both are "right".

    But this is bad on another level. I watch threads and discussions about cutters and wreckers to get the input and possible values of the current state, what is wrong with it and what I can do. Given the MR infrastructure this "can do" could have quite some impact, but I already made something (cutters) in the past. And I can tell you: Without getting clear rules stated somewhere that at least unify the drivers of a specific racing sim, there is no way out. I can't even start and only look for the straight-line-chicane drivers.
    For sure the Kunos guys have more talent and experience, but honestly I doubt they can improve anything if all the input is so ambigous and unspecified. And that's what we are after, right?

    The only rule we currently have is the Kunos penalty system, but it looks like we are not willing to accept those. That would mean we optimize our driving against the Kunos system which often violates our own version of FIA related rules. I see potential here, but we won't get anywhere just by complaining about it in unspecified and exaggerated ways*. Even Kunos needs sensible input and at this stage can only do adjustments, no overhauls.

    *and -for myself- the word cutter is still reserved for somebody who the "track boundary" discussion isn't relevant. But please don't use the word for somebody who might just have another opinion about curb usage (exactly the same than "wreckers").
     
    Andy-R likes this.
  7. 6S.Manu

    6S.Manu I'm Awesome! Staff Member KS Dev Team

    If it's the same issue with the Monza's first chicane or Spa, then it's going to be fixed with the next update.
     
    Parminio, Ace Pumpkin, Vel and 5 others like this.
  8. kofotsjanne

    kofotsjanne Alien

    I dont know about Spa, havent tried or gone offtrack there lately, if you mean at "les combes"? Thanks to this thread Ive started to notice how many drivers that actually take that little shortcut on Monza, most of the times it doesnt matter though since you get more speed on the straight if you not cutting. I think many will be confused and think that you broke the game when you fix it. :)
     
  9. Parminio

    Parminio Simracer

    Here you go from the FIA Sporting Regulations posted January 17th, 2017:

     
  10. Horus

    Horus Alien

    Thank you FIA, anything outside of the white lines are furniture NOT TRACK!
     
    Parminio likes this.
  11. Kopiller

    Kopiller Simracer

    It will be better to be given the option of a drive thru if penalized, getting penalized somewere like the last chicane in barcelona gp is like a dead sentence :(
     
    Horus likes this.
  12. Hagen

    Hagen Hardcore Simmer

    .3 Drivers must make every reasonable effort to use the track at all times and may not deliberately leave the track without a justifiable reason.

    Avoiding another car, that spun on track, is justifiable. Sadly AC cant distinct cutters from gentlemen.
    Giving the advantage gained (by avoiding others) back voluntarily, or get a slow down penalty on top of the time you lost off track.

    You have the choice, don't race on servers that have the opposite setting.
    If you are asking for more restrictive penalties, that will lead to more frustration and less servers will have them enabled.
     
    Horus likes this.
  13. Parminio

    Parminio Simracer

    He wasn't avoiding anything. He used it to his advantage. If he had been avoiding something it would have cost him a lot of time and quite possibly spun him out.

    And it is a track error. I just tested it. That one particular corner you can NOT be penalized for even when penalties are on.
     
  14. Horus

    Horus Alien

    Meh! Who really cares. You seem like you are a gentleman racer so let the fools do what they do. Once you join a league of fellow gentlemen racers Scheiße like that will not happen (often).
     
  15. 6S.Manu

    6S.Manu I'm Awesome! Staff Member KS Dev Team

    Exactly. 41m 52s



     
    Parminio likes this.
  16. kofotsjanne

    kofotsjanne Alien

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