Article: Why Force Feedback In Computer Simulators Does Not Work?

For inside curbs, yes, I was talking about outside curbs, e.g. Vallelunga last turn onto the straight.
There, if you drive onto the curb and then while on the curb turn to the right, the vibration should increase because the outer tyre does have more load at that point.
I can't remember feeling that although I think I performed such a maneuver already. Will check this evening.
Or, as another example RBR. The (famous) curbs after the penultimate corner, I'd expect the vibrations to change during curb entry (because the wheel is still turned to the right, thus the outer tyre has corner exit load) and middle/end of the curb (wheel is straight, normal load).
I don't recall feeling that. To me the vibrations felt pretty much the same when they are there.

Well yes, that's another thing. Sometimes a part of the curb doesn't give anything and then another part gives strong vibrations.
That's ok, because the actual profile of the curb might induce exactly that, since some curbs have a flat surface while others don't.
However if they look the same, I'd expect the curb to feel the same as well and e.g. at Brands Hatch, it didn't seem to me like that'd be the case.
Will test it this evening again though.

 

Was that bodnar article before he made his plugins for rfactor ffb? I think around that time the isi sims greatly improved in ffb. Not sure if this was in any way going around the issues mentioned in the article but it definatly helped ISI based sims from the time real feel and bodnar plugins came in.

AC seemed to have ffb at or above this level for me from the start and has gradually improved. I dont use any fake effects but the abs one in 1.15 sounds interesting. It will just be shaking but in the ABS cars Ive driven thats pretty much the effect I get some violent shaking when it kicks in.

The first time I got it I thought I had a flat or broken wheel lol, modern cars arent as viloent with ABS these days. But the original systems were so nasty you dont want to push the brake limits too much in them as it zapped all confidence in the car at that point.

 

Always had the impression that it is an amplifier of the forces at steering rack.

All of them or any of them?

When in my car I noticed a vibration maybe from tyres scrub and also a drop in forces ( maybe because of a dropping in tyres load?) . I always had the impression that this the rule? That's why I always asking for a slider for the enhanced understeer. thanks for the response




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there is already a drop in forces in the tyre model.. it simply isn't enough to come through the steering wheel clearly.

 

Meaning that since you won't do the enhanced understeer slider I will just buy a stronger wheel lol (runs and hides before I see myself in Siberia)


Thanks again

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It's enough to come through over here.

@liakjim: I don't think pure force is the answer but rather how well a wheel resolves small changes/forces.
IMO that's where some of the consumer wheels lack.

 

slider or scalable enhanced understeer is exactly what I would like ... when on it is too much, when of it is less than I feel in real car (I have consumer wheel, could be better on better wheels of course) ..

 

Yes, slider for the enhanced understeer please.

 

Regarding the physics FF multiplier, could that be an option to bypass for those with capable wheels? Or even an INI setting for more advanced users? I know I've been turned down before, so I'm even more determined to get it mentioned whenever the discussion comes up...

 

@Lord Kunos
Exactly that multiplier that you've already told us about some time ago, is what is currently holding me back from buying a DD wheel.
As @Berniyh correctly stated, currently, all cars FF strenght is kind of in the same ball park, to be compatible with current consumer hardware (if I understood you correctly).

So I reckoned, that a DD wheel would give me nice detail in the FF output, but it would not really allow me to experience in more variety the hugly different steering forces between eg a small road car and a high downforce race car.
I do well know, that I can tailor each cars FF to my liking, but I would not like to do that, because, honestly, apart from knowing that a servo assisted Abarth has supposedly a light wheel, and that the 962C at speed should be quite heavy, I have no clue about what should be even roughly correct for any specific car.

Do you have any plans for the future to maybe add an option for DD users that globally changes the multipliers of the cars to allow for greater variety in forces between different cars?

 

I eyeball it with the new FFBClip app, where I set the average cornering force target for each car. Modern, powerassisted cars are fairly light at 4-6Nm, the cars I imagine to be heavier I go as high as 12-15Nm, which give me peaks of over 20Nm.. It's pretty cool, and exhausting, and I have no idea if it's real, but at least it's fun!

 

You can change it for each car. Just take the reciprocal of the FF multiplier of each car and put it into the user FFB list.
It's enough if one person does that and then shares it. After that just have to copy that list into your docs/AC folder and be done.

Sure, someone has to do the list, but that should be possible with a relatively simple script.
(if the files are plain text and not encrypted. didn't check that part.)

 

nope, because it'd only work for old cars without powersteering. I've already explained it in the past, we didn't ask for power steering data so having "un-multiplied" FF would only work for a subset of AC cars making the feature very confusing to understand... cars have individual settings for FF gain, simply use that and adjust to your liking.

EDIT: Anyway, I will see if I can add something to some INI file making sure it's 100% unsupported.

 

wrt to abs feedback to come through the pedal rumble for fanatec cswv3 users?

 

Super explanation, thanks a lot.
I had FFB shudder when spinning just rear tires on the start of the race, so it doesn't seem that all 4 must slip, or you meant "any of them"?
ABS effect is it always on, as I don't see option in the menu? See no reason for someone turning it off, just curios.

 

He said it's something new in 1.15, so obviously you don't see (and feel) it yet.

 

I have FF set very low on my PC (and therefore do not experience excessive vibration), simply because I prefer to have a working steering wheel rather than a shattered collection of parts on the floor.

 

Do these sliders help people without DD wheels?

When I look at a video of a real driver's hands on the wheel, they are shacking many times more then mine are with my Fanatec v2. The only way I can think of to get closer to this degree of feed back is the sliders.

Is there a better way besides getting a DD wheel?

 

Yay! Would be nice if you guys could also make use of Fanatec's vibration motors which they say are controllable via their SDK that you are probably already using for RPM LEDs and speed/gear display. But even without that having the wheel vibrating on ABS activation is a nice addition, thank you!