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Lift off oversteer in tyres V10 vs tyres v7-

Discussion in 'Chit Chat Room' started by claudiopolez, Aug 24, 2017.

  1. Hey, I made that first video :D every time I watch an old video it makes me feel a bit sad, the lighting/color balanced used to be so much better than nowadays...

    I think some LOO was lost when they changed to the new load sensitivity code; before load sensitivity was almost unexistant, so probably the load transfer was more pronounced.
     
  2. claudiopolez

    claudiopolez Simracer

    I'm sure you mean well, but unfortunately your post lacks any solid detail. You need to post links to the video where
    a) we can see driver's input while the car is doing something like LO oversteer
    b) this car needs to be stock and available in AC.

    Talking about feelings and other sims like Automobilista is pointless - we need solid grounding in reality, not subjective opinions and other models of reality :)
     
    LeDude83 likes this.
  3. unknwn

    unknwn Alien

    Isn't this lack of front tyre bite related to how traction circle works in AC? It seems there have been numerious reports/topics that cars in AC might be a bit understeery (mostly during weight shift to the front) compared to RL counterparts (including by those who have driven specific cars in RL).
     
    Rosko and LeDude83 like this.
  4. claudiopolez

    claudiopolez Simracer

    The car is very far from stock, so we're back to zero evidence again :| I've just read this guy's youtube about page and there's all sorts going on with the suspension:
    Suspension:
    - Suspension Technologies ST XTA coilovers (rebound adjustable with camber mounts)
    - Suspension Technologies anti sway bars
    - Whiteline adjustable end links
    - SPC camber adjustable lower control arms (rear)
    (Alignment specs: Camber -2.8 front, -1.8 rear. Slight toe-out front/Slight toe-in rear).

    Brakes:
    - GrimmSpeed Master Cylinder Brace
    - Stainless steel brake lines.
    - Castrol React SRF brake fluid
    - Carbotech XP10 brake pads
    - Porsche 964 brake cooling spoilers

    Misc:
    - Schroth Rallye 3 ASM harness
    - Grimspeed Hood Damper kit
    - Perrin Shorty (4inch) antenna
    - Cusco Sport Accelerator Pedal
    - IRP Germany short shifter

    Engine:
    - Setrab 13 row Oil cooler
    - K&N airfilter
    - Gruppe S header
    - Tactrix open source ECU tune"
     
    LeDude83, mms and liakjim like this.
  5. claudiopolez

    claudiopolez Simracer

    Maybe, but once again we need solid evidence - pedal cam of a car that does something we feel may be off in AC. Without that all speculation is fruitless.
     
    mms and liakjim like this.
  6. claudiopolez

    claudiopolez Simracer

    And it was a good video too! :D
    You're a car physics guy, David, do you have any useful evidence to add? Either pro or contra, any will do - we're back to square one atm :(
     
  7. chakko

    chakko Alien

    Interesting thread... i won't comment on the subject, but, only going from a "feel" kind of view, i feel the same as the OP. Sometimes i also wonder why the cars in AC understeer, where i feel they might have to oversteer a bit more (also see my thread about the FWD touring cars...). The street cars in general feel very good in AC, but, i feel there's a certain good-natured character, while, in reality, there's a bit more loose-ness, which makes the cars oversteer more. Already wrote more than i wanted now. :D Just not good on the technical side of things.
     
  8. Cote Dazur

    Cote Dazur Alien

    Fascinating, an other thread with different AC driver finding that their is a difference driving a car in a simulator, AC in the case of this discussion, but could be any driving simulator, and driving a specific car in real life.
    My advice to all, relax and drink something fresh, it will pass.
    Yes their is differences, yes, it is not totally the same, but if you spend your time trying to immerse yourself in the simulation instead of trying to find a fault in it, you will enjoy it more, I can guarantee it.
    Never mind, keep going, as if was not even there.:D
     
  9. chakko

    chakko Alien

    No worries, i totally agree with your point. :) The thing is just that most of us won't ever have the chance to do what we do in a simulator in real life, so we strive for the most realistic alternative. ;)

    BTW, i notoriously criticize iRacing too, although i drive it regularly. Same with all other sims. :D Call it first world problems.
     
    sissydriver and Cote Dazur like this.
  10. I just made a "s1" version of the 458 italia, using the car physics from the AC 1.2 version, and clearly there is a lot more lift off oversteer. But there have been so many changes in the tyre model that I can't say what's causing this.
     
    claudiopolez likes this.
  11. TheBoss

    TheBoss Hardcore Simmer


    I have already talked about this before and I tried to provide the evidence that I could, I would not want to be repetitive, Aris replied that the tests were not enough to understand that something is wrong, so I will not work on it , For me it is the most boring car of the game and I have forgotten it.

    My tests are this, several real riders taking a spin on this car, In AC i giving hundreds of laps and never had a minimum oversteer for very aggressive that you are, nor changing to the grip of the track.



    This is the behavior I expect from the Lotus to the limit, very difficult to catch when the oversteer begins. In AC will never begin.

     
    Last edited: Aug 24, 2017
  12. TheBoss

    TheBoss Hardcore Simmer

    Could you rescue the Lotus Else physics from May 2015? There, this car was very difficult to catch and it seemed very real.
     
  13. dajdosta

    dajdosta Racer

    a
    Wait a minute.
    You are baffled how someone can question racing SIMULATOR 's accuracy of SIMULATING certain behavior of a racing car?
    And all that on a public forum? :D
     
  14. Maybe someday you guys will get your perfect simulator, you know, one where physics are sourced from Youtube vids and Top Gear clips.
     
    Andrew_WOT and Cote Dazur like this.
  15. dajdosta

    dajdosta Racer

    There is no such thing as perfection. But striving for perfection is our mission
     
    chakko likes this.
  16. mms

    mms Alien

    Wait a minute, are you saying that all those youtube videos are made with arcade real life physics? ;)
     
  17. chakko

    chakko Alien

    Well.. i can only speak for myself, but, onboards, when taken from the right angle, give a pretty good impression of how a car handles, in certain situations and conditions. Won't beat driving it yourself, of course, and i won't argue that Aris and the others try to do the best the they can to model the cars respectively. Like the guys developing other sims. And still they feel differently. ;)
     
  18. dajdosta

    dajdosta Racer

    That's a great idea! I bet some day there will be algorithms which will extract telemetry data by analyzing quality onboard videos. TeleTubies.
     
  19. Who needs algorithms to extract telemetry data when we already have simulation expert simracers who apparently already have this capability?
     
    Cote Dazur likes this.
  20. mms

    mms Alien

    I for one am not any kind of expert, just a lousy driver, and the only thing I see in those youtube videos is that in some cases people are loosing control of some of those road cars. As I don't have much success doing the same thing in AC I'm wondering if it's possible to reproduce those spins, maybe I'm just not good enough to understand why they spin in those videos in the first place.

    And don't get me (and I think most of us) wrong, I enjoy AC the most out of all sims, if anything I'm an AC fanboy, on my scale AC is doing things right 99.98% of the time, it's just my greediness that I'd like to have it @ 99.99% :oops:
     
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