Talk about that AI

Can't believe this thread actually survive so long

The main problem may comes from the root: the words ! I think IMHO this "thing" should be called "computer controlled opponents" (CCO), because in AI, there is Intelligence, and it is mostly about solving problem with incomplete data set (a perfectly defined problem is what we call "maths", which is not strictly accurate of course).

Also things like super computers used to defeat human beings in a "simple" problem as games (chess and go mostly) are not intelligent at all, try to give them some basic problem you solve everyday like a description of an issue with your house plumbing, the "dumbest" plumber around will beat those "super AI" in no time ! Chess, as most of the classic board games, can be just played using tree algorithms (get all possible combinations, give a score to them, choose the best score x moves ahead, you win)

Unfortunately, racing is quite a challenge to reduce to a simple problem to solve like this, parameter set is amazingly high and physics gives a lot of trouble on their own (grip is even not constant on any track and this is even not simulated I bet). And devs have pick the poor "rail" system which is something that should have been ban for decade as it is just ridiculous.

So far, the best CCO I've ever seen is in Flatout Ultimate Carnage, Bugbear did a very great job in it, just too bad they have failed with their dead-born Ultimate Car Game . Another good one was in F1GP, the 1st one released in 1991 !

 

100% AI vs AI.

 

they need to pass, instead they just like to line up behind

 

Seems to me that the difference in speed between two cars needs to be in a certain window for the AI to deem it safe to evertake?

 

I only have two issues with the AI.

1. They usually never make mistakes like crashing out or overextending a corner.

2. They usually have a hard time passing slower cars, making WEC racing not so optimal.


Would love those things eventually to get better but being a coder I know it's not easy to just fix.

 

Absolutely no clue to be honest. Sometimes they overtake surprisingly well and sometimes they get stuck, depends on the overtaking car, the overtaken car and the track. In the video we see both. 911 GT3 R stuck behind 935/78 that walks away on straights but is slow in corners. The 919 gets stuck behind the GT3 R for a bit but has no problems at all in that particular set of circumstances to overtake the Praga, 911 and 935, makes exceptionally good overtakes actually. So, no idea.

 

Look at the bright side: The AI isn't half as bad as the vast majority of online players, so you've got that going for you.

 

I wonder if a second AI line would help them deal with slower cars?

So we have fast_lane.ai for the AI to follow for the best line. How about if we were able to create overtake_lane.ai too; like an alternative line that the AI could be programmed to use if they come up behind a slower / stricken car ahead that already occupies the fast_lane.ai?

Car ahead=true
closing speed >x
fast_lane.ai free=false
use overtake_lane.ai

 

I've seen quite a few cases where faster class AI cars follow behind slower AI cars for a lap or more, then when I catch up and pass them all, those faster cars then finally make the pass.

 

I've been playing raceroom a lot lately and their AI is pretty good. Also their adaptive capabilities are great. I was doing 1:56 flat on suzuka and the adaptive AI were lapping between 1:56;100 and 1:56;400. That's a very good basis for challenging races.
I would love to see this kind of AI in Assetto Corsa. Seeing them fighting amongst each other on the track or simply not backing down when you try to pass them.

I'm mainly a single player racer, so the AI is very important to me.

 

Aside from the general AC AI, there must also be some kind of aggression settings/parameters designed into each car, because the URD EGT mod cars can be aggressive as hell. They aren't afraid to shoot for even really narrow openings, they stand their ground and rarely back off through corners unless you totally dive-bomb them, and they pass clean and close. Not sure how URD achieved this, but if all KS cars drove like the URD cars, races would be much more intense.

 

ive set up a custom f1 career with all the tracks and skins for the sf15t and its ruined by AI level 100 spending laps in a train behind AI level 92's or around there without even looking like they want to overtake

also if i were to set them all to 100 then they'd just follow each other round perfectly in a train, there is no randomness to pace or anything, its so predictable and stupid

 

Totally agree i've had the same thought before. It seems like the AI can cope with some cars but not others not sure if is even fast cars and slow or just certain cars. They seem ok in the 718RS but they cannot drive the GTA at all, always at really low rpm and doing odd gear changes. IIRC the Lotus 25 is another car they struggle with. Sorting out multi class would be nice but I think more important is them being able to drive all cars in a competent way.

Could they have another ideal line for when 2 cars are side by side? like splitting the track in half and have them race to that. So they would have an inner and outer an ideal and ideal when side by side.

 

lol I dunno if subconsciously I saw the rest of your post @Fat-Alfie but I read the first bit quoted and replied going on to outline exactly the suggestion you made in the rest of your comment

 

Just goes to show how amazing we both are, and that great minds think alike

I'm glad someone else thinks along the same (AI) lines as me, though

 

do the AI have some kind of prompt for when to shift? if that.is generic to all cars maybe that is the reason they do so badly in certain vehicles. the GTA and 595SSS2 are good examples of cars the AI struggle to drive and both have pretty narrow power bands (or atleast need high rpm)

Your post confuses me... as do a lot of your posts I said (or meant) that the AI being able to drive all cars reasonably well should be a priority over improving their behaviour in multiclass/with much slower cars... and you call nonsense but then go on to suggest that there isnt much that can be done about AI multiclass? I wish I could remember how to do the confused emoticon, I could use it right now.

 

yep I understand now and that makes sense, you did a good job of explaining that so maybe I will pluck up the courage to ask in MR drivers thread how the language recognition thing relates to MR/MP and the same for the machine learning algorithmebob in general

 

The 935/78 is another candidate that can struggle a lot around certain tracks in certain situations.

I suppose it's when the shift up and shift down values are set far apart with a high revving engine with power up top (like the 935 that takes a while to get going) the AI can get caught up in situations where it gets stuck just above the revs where it'd shift down. Btw the AI also can't deal with changed rev limiter in the setup (via ai_default) from what I've seen.