Ferrari DLC & 1.15 - Discuss Away

understeer? not enough oversteer?

Sorry, you've lost me. Certainly didn't drive the car that I just drove.

 

The 250 GTo was the hardest car to drive on Assetto Corsa. Now, I have some doubts, the Maserati 250F with 12 cylinder is again the most difficult, probably.

 

Harder than C9 ? Harder than F40 ? Harder than Huayra ? Harder than Yellowbird ? Harder than Cobra ?

It is interesting how many simracers finds 250F difficult, it is true you have to countersteer all the time, but thats all, and it is not very hard to catch, 250F is one of the best of AC cars, such an awesome car, preffered more before the fix, but maybe it was too floaty for nice dry surfaces.

 

It is very easy to drive. But it is very hard to pilot like a Fangio.

 

Yeah same.... But it's a pretty common thing that most simracers cant wheel a car very well. Some can get decent pace in modern cars, but as soon as you need to slide around a bit, nope lol.

 

yea i also get that impression... and it seems to me that assetto feels very accurate on carburators behaviour when using the throttle.. i had no idea about the difference, since im used to my 2013 injected hatch in RL... after i started to drive something carburated and figured its nuances , and that was after assetto, i improved a lot in older cars and enjoyed them even more in the sim

 

Difficult yes, of course everything is relative. The 250F is particular difficult IMHO because refuses to track in a straight line, its always want to go left or right quite easily but never quite straight, hahaha. Looking at the old footage of these cars I am amazed at how smoothly the drivers are able to handle them.

Perhaps difficult isn't the best word, awkward might be a better descriptor.

 

Of course time, practice and focus. Lots of people perhaps are more interested in jumping in and racing versus taking the time to understand handling in a particular car, taking the time to focus on a particular car and make a huge difference IMHO.

I really didn't come into my own regarding this ie; catching and holding slides, etc , until Assetto Corsa.

The last time I drive a decent sim on the computer was LFS back in 2010 or so, then I moved to Japan and up until last year was completely absent from the sim community. Since discovering AC May of last year my education and understanding of vehicle handling has expanded by leaps and bounds. I attribute this to the great community here at assettocorsa.net, the amazing FFB feel, physics and tire model of AC , a great book on driving in AC I discovered and plenty of seat time in a variety of cars.

Driving cars like the Masrati 250F, Cobra 427 , Lotus type 25 and more recently the 250 GTO have helped me become much more comfortable with vehicles in oversteer and sliding situations. I'm more concerned with proper car handling, speed will come with time.

Lately I've been driving all cars at 94% at a variety of tracks, its fascinating how quickly I've adapted to lower grip level when previously I'd never go below 97%

I'm always perplexed when I see severs running GT3 cars at Nords and the grip level is 100%. With all that downforce the cars are much more interesting to drive at 95% and lower track grip.

Is this realistic, I have no idea, although I know I like a challenge, driving the car , the track and batting the competitors around me.

 

Raw car control and chasing laptimes are still somewhat different, but overlapping, disciplines. It's why rally drivers might do ok on a circuit, but will almost definitely get beat by circuit racing specialists.

Car control is obviously very useful and important but if you spend more time practicing that rather than circuit driving for laptime, you're likely to end up short handed in a race situation because others will have spent more time and effort studying braking points and racing lines and whatnot that give them the edge. Sure you might recover brilliantly from a slide, but did that make you faster? Or did it just make you better at correcting what is still ultimately a mistake?

 

What you're saying makes sense, although make no mistake I focus quite a bit on braking points and the racing line as well as driving off the racing line. After learning the layout of a track the next thing I focus on is finding the best braking points, then tweak them until I'm as close to the edge of grip at turn as possible. And certainly, I keep an eye on lap times and the small things that contribute to decreased lap times.

 

Yea, that's optimal. You cant have one without the other, but you definitely need to put in that effort chasing laptime, too.

 

I won't argue with that.

Its about balance for me and of course having a good time. Also, I don't push for max laptimes until I can do a series of laps within 5/10ths or less of each other. For me consistency is king !

 

This is was the difference between Alain Prost and Ayrton Senna.

When everything was normal and pacing was the most important thing, Prost was better. But, when the things change, just a little, Senna was the better driver. Specially on qualifys because on that days they didnt have too many chances with qualify tyres, the same on turbo era the same with the most powered engines. Rain is the most delicated situation, and Senna was obviously better than Prost on this situation.

 

I can't wait to try the updated 250 GTO.

Pre-patch I found it ok, already and my movements at the wheel were similar to what you see in the Goodwood events. There was quite some entry underster to exit oversteer issue but it could be "driven out" of the car by adjusting technique. I made it around Nordschleife without crashing or WTF moments, right away.

The 250 F I recall as trickier to drive. But maybe I have THAT pre-patch version in mind. It got a lot more accessible after its patch, as well.

Anyways - if the RL reviewers said the GTO was predictable and kind of safe to drive, then it doesn't match well with pre-patch AC version - too much finesse needed to make it behave. Hope I can test tonight.

 

I was not all that impressed with the handling of the 250 GTO when the Ferrari Pack was released, so it will be interesting to see if this update reveals any significant improvements.

 

I enjoyed the handling of the 250 GTO v1, on the Nordschleife, the first time I tried it.
However, trying to push it a bit more, I found it pretty tricky, especially when countersteering without lifting off.

I wasn't disappointed, but I wasn't totally comfortable with it.
I haven't tried the v2 yet.

For me, the biggest surprise came from the car I was the less interested about : the 312/67.

I thought it was unnecessary because we already have the Lotus 49.
But when I tried the Ferrari on the Nords, it was a blast!
One of the best experience for me in AC, seriously!
Predictable, stable, damn quick : this is the car I feel the most "in phase" with.

I wasn't a fan of the Lotus 49 but I have to try it again, to see if it handles like the Ferrari...

 

Luckily it doesn't.

Tried them both at Monza '66 and without changing much in the setup (alignment and suspension untouched). The L49 already felt good with nice controllable slides at high speeds when on throttle, whereas the Ferrari was understeering off the track in the same situation.
So the Lotus is not only noticeable faster but (IMO) handles better.


The 250GTO after the update makes more sense to me. Yeah it was fun to slide around, but earlier it felt like driving on track covered with oil, that wheelspin was too much IMO. Now it can still oversteer in 3rd gear but tyres won't light up in 2nd with just a touch of the throttle.

 

I drove it around Nords Tourist yesterday. Could only do 2 laps because it was already quite late.

I've only driven the car at Goodwood before, there it felt very similar to the 250F. Controllable oversteer, but with a necessity to have it oversteer to get into the corner, otherwise it would understeer.
Now the car is completely changed, it's no longer anything like the 250F in my opinion.
It's much more like e.g. the Moby Dick. It turns in under throttle by moving it's arse out a bit.
Not so much that you really have oversteer (or only a tiny bit), but just enough that you kill the understeer.
With the update, the car got incredibly nimble in my opinion, given that it uses stoneage tyres and suspension.
If you push down the throttle too much – just like the Moby Dick – it will oversteer and you will drift through the corner (very controllable though).

Not sure if I prefer the car before or after the update, both were a lot of fun.

 

Indeed ! 2nd gear was brutal !!

 

FFB of 250GTO since update seems to load up a bit too much at particular stages of cornering, like unconforably too much relatively to how little feedback there is at other stages of cornering.