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Look what the cat hacked in - s02eo2

Discussion in 'Chit Chat Room' started by zaratul, Aug 25, 2015.

Page 6 of 8
  1. David Dominguez

    David Dominguez Alien

    You can always ask to mr Motec if you are not a friend of videos and perceived stuff :p

    http://i.imgur.com/ciyFgva.png

    This was achieved with the Lotus 98T, track grip to "fast" and medium tyres with default setup and high-ish wings at Estoril T1-T2 (can't send link for obvious reasons). I think it's obvious that such car can't corner over 5Gs (probably not even 4Gs, which is closer to modern F1s). Even if the aerodynamics aren't super accurate, the difference would need to be huge to justify those huge lateral Gs.
     
    David Dominguez, Aug 27, 2015
    #101
    F430_458_F12 likes this.
  2. Mogster

    Mogster Alien

    Spa GP 1986 pole time 1:54.331
    Spa GP 2015 pole time 1:47.179

    RSR Spa Lotus 98T WR time 1:50.619

    There are of course many many variables that could affect these numbers.

    Spa has changed since 1986 but not out of all recognition. In the 80s 2/3 of the track was public roads and it was very bumpy. It's much smoother now with the re-surfacing and the aviation tarmac.

    It's obvious that these late 80s turbo cars weren't slow, in fact it appears they weren't much slower than modern F1.
     
    Mogster, Aug 27, 2015
    #102
  3. misterbeam

    misterbeam Hardcore Simmer

    Once, a modder who is a friend of mine said : " I can't make this game as realistic as real life, so i will start making real life as realistic as this game" :D

    A car that was able to corner at nearly 5 g has done 1.44 on the new spa which is about 1.5 - 2s slower than the old layout ... just sayin' ... no matter how the track changed, the difference can't be 6 secs
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2015
    misterbeam, Aug 27, 2015
    #103
  4. stefanoCasillo

    stefanoCasillo Alien

    just to be clear.. this is not the tyre you posted in the other page right?
    This one suggests the "falling off" load sensitivity that can be achieved with the new values. and it is the behavior I was expecting because it's easy to explain physically by the extreme deformation.
    But one important factor to consider (just as when it comes to behavior beyond the point of grip slip) is that, at those levels of load, temperature are likely going over the roof, producing an additional degradation in grip... which explains why you see the weird stuff you see in the tyre tester app at high speed/loads.. ;) That's factoring temps and relaxation length in.
     
    stefanoCasillo, Aug 28, 2015
    #104
    Glaurung and F430_458_F12 like this.
  5. David Dominguez

    David Dominguez Alien

    The red line is based on @misterbeam's tyre posted here , using DY0=2.0958333 DY1=-0.282 (using the last 3 data points to estimate them). I calculated the mu at every 1000N up to 10000N and multiplied them together to get the lateral forces.

    I agree with the temperature factor, and it's true that it can influence at high loads/slip angles etc. Didn't know about relaxation lenght influence, do you mind to elaborate a bit? It's interesting :)
     
    David Dominguez, Aug 28, 2015
    #105
  6. stefanoCasillo

    stefanoCasillo Alien

    plus

    Real lap: Condition, unknown, being Spa you can't really bet on perfectly clear sky. Drivers probably got 1 max 3 attempts at full boost with qualifying tyres. Let it sit in for a little while.. there were probably a total of 6 "hot" laps made by the 98T in Spa ever.. 6... in history.

    RSR time: The result of thousands of attempt, in a comfy chair with perfect conditions every single time and no risk to end your life in a wall.

    Then think we're talking about a 1000Hp monster with level of downforce almost unseen before and after in F1 with TRex size tyres.. so yeah.. it'll do that.
     
    stefanoCasillo, Aug 28, 2015
    #106
    Kristaps, witoldinho, Steffen Lauge Sørensen and 5 others like this.
  7. stefanoCasillo

    stefanoCasillo Alien

    the tyre tester app is actually simulating what a real tyre tester machine would do to get the numbers out. So it's taking a tyre, setting the load and speed from the tyre on the car running and it's performing a slip angle/slip ratio sweep to record the results.. the tyre is fully dynamic during the sweep, that's why it's so slow and why the results are sometimes surprising. The car speed (and the speed of the sweep itself, that cannot be changed in the GUI but I often change it to check things out by code) can be a very big influence in the final result.
     
    stefanoCasillo, Aug 28, 2015
    #107
    David Dominguez likes this.
  8. David Dominguez

    David Dominguez Alien

    That's I asked you in the other thread if it was possible to have that virtual tyre tester machine outside of the sim :p so we can see those results, but also numerically, and with more calm (when the car is running everything happens so fast that it's hard to get info sometimes).
     
    David Dominguez, Aug 28, 2015
    #108
  9. Avoletta

    Avoletta Simracer

    No way they can work with the AC tire model, even on a very light car.
     
    Avoletta, Aug 28, 2015
    #109
  10. Avoletta

    Avoletta Simracer

    I hope this post is a joke...
     
    Avoletta, Aug 28, 2015
    #110
    nonnex likes this.
  11. stefanoCasillo

    stefanoCasillo Alien

    Are you guys totally sure those data are in N? It looks to me like a colossal amount of load sens for such small loads... could it be lbf?
     
    stefanoCasillo, Aug 28, 2015
    #111
  12. Stereo

    Stereo Alien

    If a bad model fits the data, you don't have enough data to find a good model.
     
    Stereo, Aug 28, 2015
    #112
  13. David Dominguez

    David Dominguez Alien

    Yes (N).
     
    David Dominguez, Aug 28, 2015
    #113
  14. stefanoCasillo

    stefanoCasillo Alien

    damn you, I should be working on something else and you convinced me to look into lookup tables for DY :p . Interestingly I've found a function to get smooth data out of my lookup table class.. I guess Giovanni must have written it.. I didn't remember it was there... it could also be very useful to define engine curves without too many points... like insert minimum, max torque, max power and be done.
     
    stefanoCasillo, Aug 28, 2015
    #114
    Horst1, Thomas Gocke, Dookie and 8 others like this.
  15. David Dominguez

    David Dominguez Alien

    Cubic spline function, perhaps? :)
     
    David Dominguez, Aug 28, 2015
    #115
  16. Znam Neznam

    Znam Neznam Hardcore Simmer

    speaking of tyre

    Vettel through Eau Rouge from past weekends race.

    When is this coming Kunos? :eek:

    what ya reckon is the load on that rear tyre lol

    [​IMG]
     
    Znam Neznam, Aug 28, 2015
    #116
    Kristaps, ChokDK, Steffen Lauge Sørensen and 2 others like this.
  17. tommi karsikas

    tommi karsikas Alien

    Based on the suspension and the sparks... it's MAXed.
     
    tommi karsikas, Aug 28, 2015
    #117
  18. F430_458_F12

    F430_458_F12 Alien

    Vettel did it on purpose :p
     
    F430_458_F12, Aug 28, 2015
    #118
    Mogster and David Dominguez like this.
  19. Quffy

    Quffy Alien

    Quffy, Aug 28, 2015
    #119
    F430_458_F12 likes this.
  20. Guidofoc

    Guidofoc Alien

    @Lord Kunos ..to make the day easier for you why don't you try the fantastic Formula Renault mod David Dominguez and his team-mates at Virtua Simulazioni have released? I am not a fan of formula cars but this car is just made with awesome sauce!
    http://www.assettocorsa.net/forum/i...zioni-formula-renault-3-5-1-1-released.19848/
    I think the more you communicate about this physics stuff the more awesome mods we get..
    ..And why not make it official? :D
     
    Guidofoc, Aug 28, 2015
    #120
Page 6 of 8
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