Brake pressure/sensitivity needed!

Not sure what kind of answer you were looking for from someone that would have no idea as to why Kunos makes the decisions they make.

 

Probably the cars need good brakes so they can lock tires in optimal grip with the grippiest tire (slicks in road cars) in most conditions. At least that's the way I see it and I kinda follow similar way of thinking with my own cars.

 

Right, but road car brakes just aren't that strong....

 

Having very very high brake torque makes these street cars brake as well as lmp1?

 

No...it makes them lock their tires very quickly...with braking, you're essentially limited by two things, maximum braking torque at the wheels, and the force the tires can generate. Generally you want the torque to be slightly higher than if it were at an equilibrium with the tire grip, just so that you can lock the tires/have some room to play with. On AC street cars, the torque is (the last time I checked) quite a bit higher than necessary (and -at least was, on some cars- higher than the torque produced by LMP1 braking systems - which in their own right can lock the wheels of a car with 50% grippier tires than your average street car), hence the easy locking due to the tire grip being overcome by relatively little brake input.

 

+1

I think BP adjustment would be a welcomed an essential addition.. I am surprised it was left out.

 

Even NFS Shift 2 had it.

 

After spending some time with Raceroom and AMS, i have to agree this is still one of the weak points of AC. I already upped the Brake gamma to 2.20 if i'm not mistaken but you still have to treat them way to carefully.

Normally you'd stamp on the brakes hard when braking initially and then gradually release brake pressure, but this is not possible in AC. If a brake pressure slider won't be implemented to avoid exploits, can brake settings be adjusted so that the type of braking I mentioned above can be made possible?

 

Adjusting the brake pressure would only allow people to stump on the brakes without ever locking them. That doesn't sound right. The driver needs to have the required foot sensitivity. That's what makes good drivers. It can be achieved practicing for long months, not hours. It is the most challenging thing to master but it is crucial to going faster.

The brake gamma is all you need, and you can still stump on the brakes and release them progressively. Monza t1 is a good place to practice.

I hope that Kunos can resist to the pressures to turn this into an arcade.

 

Like i said, i have it at 2.20 which is quite high already but if i stamp on the brakes i lock them immediately. Turn them even higher? Which is your setting?

 

You cannot stump all the way. You need to know the point when they will lock and stump only to that point. Practice will show you the exact point for each car/corner. Muscle memory is the most important thing and that takes a lot of time to master.

 

1. That's essentially how they set it in real life (not to mention that Kunos brake torque values are a lot higher than anything I've ever seen, so you're using way less brake pedal travel than they do IRL anyway)
2. It's more realistic to have the adjustment on the race cars than to not have it.

 

It is not really a magic trick to achieve perfect braking if you just try to set it for one setting because that one setting won't work all that well everywhere. What will happen is that in some corner you may get it just perfect (with certain fuel load and tire wear) but then in some other corner you'd need more braking but because of the setup there is no more braking available so you lose performance. And in most other corners you need to modulate anyways. In cars with downforce it gets it even less useful.

The part of the track which makes the biggest difference is not the initial braking but the trail braking into the corners. Good drivers can brake harder and carry more speed into the corner but that is because they can do it in every corner at the limit. Bad driver may feel adjusting brake pressure to avoid locking gives him a benefit but what is more likely to happen is that you only gain consistence in maybe one corner but become slower in other parts of the track.

And even then the trail braking is only relatively small aspect of fast lap time. For 99% people the biggest gains come from hitting the apex and getting good exits. A difference between really good braking and alien braking will only net you some tenths per lap whereas corner exit can easily bring seconds.

Brake gamma is a horrible thing and I would not recommend it to anyone. It just makes it a lot harder to brake consistently.

The way I see it brake pressure setting could be seen as parameter that is not a setup tool but a tool to make adjustment so different pedals can be used with ac. A usability setting. Just like adjusting ffb strength is a usability setting so is brake pressure setting, although to lesser deal. Still, I don't hear anyone complaining about people being able to use light ffb because everyone understands ffb wheels are different. Somehow people still assume the brake pedals are more similar and that one size fits all.

 

You completely missed my point, I never said that braking is the same in every corner or that it is the most important thing in going faster.

 

You said:

I think I addressed that. Not only is that statement wrong but any gains you could have from such system are really small.

 

Has there been any dev feedback about this topic? I'd wager a majority of us would like some sort of adjustment to what we have currently, as it seems brake gamma alone just isn't sufficient to get it right, and a lot of people suffer from lock ups as soon as they touch the pedal.

 

the discussion has been intelligent and interesting until now.. pls do not start polluting the thread with pure horse****.. thank you. Whoever "locks up as soon they touch the pedals" simply need new pedals.

EDIT: cow -> horse

 

Well it's a slight exaggeration to get the point across, not to be taken literally and no need to feel insulted neither.
I hear a lot of people complaining about it and i suffer from it myself. I don't have the best pedals around (CSR) but seeing this problem does not occur in other race sims and i can apply full brake pressure there, i doubt the problem lays with my pedals.

Feel free to give any advice as the only adjustment i tried so far is upping brake gamma, but as far as i can tell this is the only option available in game, so not more that i can do.

 

My brake pedal is so stiff........hahaha....That I've got to turn the pressure UP in other sims because of AC.
#needbrakeadjustment

 

well don't do that... you'll only achieve a big loss in credibility and piss us off, which you really don't want right?

Nothing to suggest other than understanding that, in AC, full brake will lock the tyres on most cars.. and that's exactly what we want form the software.. it's designed to do exactly that, so learn to control your pedal just as everybody else does.

Next time we have the chance to talk with engineers at Vallelunga we'll ask about the brake pressure settings and how they are actually used in real life and consider a change if they give interesting answers.